Quality of a Kawai Piano? Need Advice

[leftca]

To start this post i will put in some background about my self. I am 16 and have been playing piano for 8 years. The first 4 i had a cheap $100 Casio electric piano, i then got an 1900 something aeolian upright which i have had now for 4 years. I have been interested in getting a grand piano. I went to Sherman and Clay pianos up in san francisco tried all the steinways but nothing sparked with any of them. I went to Colton pianos, even the hundred thousand dollar schimmel seemed ehh. I then went to the big yamaha san jose state sale. Tried over 60 pianos none of which I really liked. (Bosendorfers, Yamahas, Mason Hamlin, etc) I recentally went to another piano store. They have this beautiful K. Kawai Grand GS-60 (7 foot conservatory model)It is 1994 and they are asking 17,500 for it. I sat down on it and the action and sound just clicked i instantly fell in love it provides me with the power but also allows me to play very soft. A week later after measuring our living room out we were all ready to make the purchase but then my mom asked my piano teacher about Kawai. She sold pianos 40 years ago in a Baldwin store, so my parents believe she is credible. But something seems off. She literally called Kawai pianos pieces of junk stating that due to the cheap wood obtained from the Philippine's it has a tendency to be softer therefore not holding a tune for more than a month. And that the tuning knobs screw holes are screwed using the same drill bit, which gets hot and damages the wood?. She also says at a convention she saw a Kawai taken apart and it was junk compared to Steinway, Yamaha, or Baldwin. Now my parents have turned their heads and refuse to buy anything with the Kawai name on it. Are these facts true? I cant find anything on the internet about it? I know the people here know their stuff and want some opinions from a true professional.

Thanks
NAthan

[quantum]

Unless your piano teacher can produce credible evidence to support these claims, I would not take such comments seriously.  Were these comments part of the sales pitch that was thrown about 40 years ago?  If Kawai was such a poor manufacturer, why would Steinway trust them to manufacture their Boston line of pianos?

I've played many Kawais.  Used to own a small vertical, and the university I studied at was furnished with Kawais.  They are a solid piano maker.  Their pianos can take the abuse thrown at them from a university setting.  I play a lot of avant-garde styled music and have bashed many Kawais in the process.  From personal experience, I can say that they hold up extremely well to vigorous playing. 

The GS series is very good, there were lots of them at university.  It seems you have done a good deal to shop around, and if the GS-60 speaks to you, then listen to what your ears are telling you.  Don't be put off because it is not a brand with a high-end price tag.  Get the piano that you will love to play every day. 

As for evaluating the condition of a piano, an experienced piano technician is your best bet.  Hire an independent technician to check out that piano, and give his/her opinion.  Hire several technicians if you wish more opinion.  I must stress, to turn your head away from an entire piano brand on the sole comments of a piano teacher would not be a reasonable course of action. 

[hfmadopter]

Since your teachers main line in the piano store, I assume, was Baldwin, then what she is telling you is probably part of the story they told their customers so they wouldn't go buy a Kawai ! Back then is about the same time Kawai started showing up in my area, I had not heard of them prior to then locally. Some people back then thought they were junk but my piano tuner took on the Kawai line of pianos in the early 80's. He thought they were well made is the best I can tell you. Since I already owned my Miller I was not particularly interested but he said to stop in to his shop and he could physically show me the reasons why he felt they were well made.

The Henry F Miller line of pianos is very close in design to Steinway, without the big name. This I've gotten from several different techs over the years. The new ones are made in China or someplace but the old ones were not. The company was Boston based originally. If you run into one of those, it may be worth giving it a few minutes of your time, FWIW.

Your problem now is not our opinion at any rate but your parents opinions ! Maybe see if you can get them to contact some technicians and get more unbiased opinion on the piano.

[withindale]

Have a good look at https://www.pianobuyer.com/.

If Mom's budget stretches to them try Bechstein, Bluthner, Estonia, Fazioli, Forster, Grotrian, Hoffmann, Sauter, Shigeru Kawai, Steingraeber, and the Yamaha S and CFx series.

Failing all that try to persuade Mom and your teacher about the Kawai.

[tosca1]

Your piano teacher's comments certainly bring her credibility into question. The intense rivalries among piano dealers selling competing brands is certainly not new and her misleading statements reflect the extent to which unscrupulous dealers felt and still feel threatened by competition.

The GS or Grand Supreme was a highly rated line of Kawai grand pianos and were part of Shigeru Kawai's thrust in improving grand piano production which eventully culminated in the acclaimed Shigeru Kawai grand pianos.

I would seek professional opinions from those who know what they are talking about: ie piano tuners and technicians.  As with any used piano that you are seriously considering to buy, have the piano checked by an independent technician.

Good luck,

Robert.

[faulty_damper]

THe fact that she made a blanket statement like that really makes her un-credible.  That's like saying all piano teachers who were once piano salesmen are bad.  Anyway, go with your feelings and buy it!

[seb1982]

All I can offer by way of advice is that I've played many excellent Kawais in my time.  I understand that since they started to make models in China, the quality has slipped, but I haven't played enough of the ultra-modern ones to offer a knowledgeable opinion on them.  This certainly wouldn't be the case with this '94 model, though.

I have, however, played many, many Kawais of the 90s era.  Many were *superb*, and many I didn't gel with, but that's really just for personal reasons - there was nothing *wrong* with the pianos.  One of my old teachers, who also taught piano at one of the UK's leading music colleges had an early 90s Kawai grand in his house.  I went for lessons with him for about 6 or 7 years.  Never once was there an issue with the piano, and that poor thing was battered silly daily!

When I was at music college, there were a lot of dodgy Steinway Bs.  Granted, there were only a few Kawai uprights around the place, but I never came across a *bad* one.

Just my thoughts, anyway.  I'd say go for it if you love it - 17,500 dollars sounds like a very good price indeed from this side of the Atlantic