Need some feedback for La Donna e Mobile

[senanserat]

Greetings!

Ah, my fellow pianist how I longed to post some advance, but alas mixing piano and a engineering career is a tricky affair, nevertheless in my heart piano will be my priority, while nowhere near the level, nay the talon of the level I wish to be I always strive to improve.

That is why I ask of thy, to give me some advice or critic, hell don't hold any punches! I am tougher than what I look and if you wanna flame me head on do so, all I ask is the reason why and if possible how to improve it.

Now! I know this rendition is nowhere as good and it has some minor issues (in my opinion) but I have been seeing it about a month and I think its at least tolerable (my neighbors are yet to complain) , my goal with this piece is to play it allegro cantabile.  I will attach the sheet of the arr. my professor gave me in case there is a doubt regarding the text.

As always Best Wishes!
-SS

[j_menz]

What's wrong with the end bit that you omit it?

It's coming along. It needs to be a bit faster, a little freeer and a lot more playful.

Mind you hold the rests for their full value, especially that whole bar rest near the start. Also, to my ears your timing is off on those dotted quaver figures with the leading grace note - the semiquaver seems to come in too early and get held too long.

Nice job generally.

[senanserat]

What's wrong with the end bit that you omit it?

It's coming along. It needs to be a bit faster, a little freeer and a lot more playful.

Mind you hold the rests for their full value, especially that whole bar rest near the start. Also, to my ears your timing is off on those dotted quaver figures with the leading grace note - the semiquaver seems to come in too early and get held too long.

Nice job generally.

What end? Do you mean why i don't repeat from the beginning? If that's so I am playing  it without going back the beginning to avoid dragging it too long.

I will mind the rest for my next recording, also I will try to speed it up and add more character, as for the quavers you mean in those seen in the 7 measure and so on?

I don't speak English as my mother tongue, so excuse my lack of...understanding in some of those ares.

[j_menz]

What end?

From bar 42 on in the score provided. It seems to be missing in the performance.

as for the quavers you mean in those seen in the 7 measure and so on?

They're the ones, yes.

[senanserat]

From bar 42 on in the score provided. It seems to be missing in the performance.

They're the ones, yes.

1.Yeah because that's basically repeating the it again until the end where instead of the Do, it close with the chord I skipped it in the recording.

2.Damnit! I had special care to play them as I heard in some videos and I even double checked with Synthesia, its fairly late so I'll work on that tomorrow.

Also I have to figure a way to make it more cantabile.

Thanks a lot Herr Mentor! I'll try harder tomorrow

[awesom_o]

You play the correct notes and the correct rhythms. Now you need to play it with more feeling! 

Try to capture the spirit of the singers when they sing this!

[senanserat]

Here, I tried harder and I think it is kinda better, I still feel there are some ways to go.

[j_menz]

Here, I tried harder and I think it is kinda better, I still feel there are some ways to go.

Correct on both counts.

Next suggestion is to go off and listen to a few recordings on YT of the aria being sung, and then imbue your playing with that sense.

[senanserat]

Correct on both counts.

Next suggestion is to go off and listen to a few recordings on YT of the aria being sung, and then imbue your playing with that sense.

So far I have only heard Pavarotti (my favorite) I'm afraid I am not very well versed in Arias or Operas, but I will try I feel that it would be a nice, steady step towards my goals if I managed to bring that "voice"  quality to this piece, after all I think it was Chopin who said pianist should listen to singers

It may be a bit ambiguous but what do you think gives that feel to a piece? Is it the correct usage of dynamics?

[j_menz]

It may be a bit ambiguous but what do you think gives that feel to a piece? Is it the correct usage of dynamics?

Dynamics, breathing, a singers legato (and a singers rather less clippy staccatto).

Also, most singers sing with the rhythm, rather than on the rhythm. Not that they are out of time, just a little more fluid.  It's particularly effective with Verdi, whose musical accompaniment is generally pretty tumpty tumpty tummy. Strictly on the beat in the LH, then, but a little freer in the right - still in rhythm, but not sweating exactly hitting the beats.

For a good example of just how far you can go, listen to some Frank Sinatra. It's jazz, but it can be toned down and used effectively.

[senanserat]

Dynamics, breathing, a singers legato (and a singers rather less clippy staccatto).

Also, most singers sing with the rhythm, rather than on the rhythm. Not that they are out of time, just a little more fluid.  It's particularly effective with Verdi, whose musical accompaniment is generally pretty tumpty tumpty tummy. Strictly on the beat in the LH, then, but a little freer in the right - still in rhythm, but not sweating exactly hitting the beats.

For a good example of just how far you can go, listen to some Frank Sinatra. It's jazz, but it can be toned down and used effectively.

Grrrr... I feel some of those kinds are not developed overnight, but I will try, there were legato staccatos (sounds like a fancy dish) in Bach's Minuet in G No.6 so I am not a complete stranger to the idea, nevertheless....

I have never played jazz before, it doesn't beckon me too much but I am very intereste in learning a couple of jazzy pieces because the knowledge and abilities I can get from those odd and swinging tempos is invaluable.

Anyway, here comes another rendition, the last for tonight because it is almost 10pm and I cannot do "noise" not that anyone complained so far but why risk it.

For this shoot I tried to "sing count" in my head as a way of trying to get the feel of those breaths a singer must take also I tried to put emphasis in the dynamics...not that my pp is as pp as it should be.

As a side note I was considering using the pedal but because I don't have much experience (read none) with it I was wondering if for the feel I want to evoke if it would be better to press and release for each beat in the bass or slightly press for the duration of the measure, after all as far I know it breaths when the harmony changes but this bass changes per measure (mostly)

[j_menz]

For pedaling, I think you should leave it for the moment. Possibly leave it entirely. Verdi's basses tend to be best when not blurred at all.

The rhythmic freedom I was talking about certainly takes time to get the hang of, I just wanted to sow the seed.

It still need more dynamic contrast, and your legatos aren't  cantabile enough yet. A singer has the option to glide from note to note; you can't do that, but you need to try and give that impression.

In the second last bar, make sure the legatos are clear and the staccatos are crisp.There should be air between the duplets.

Don't sweat your pp, btw - you've got lots of room to go louder. This score is marked in a pretty tame fashion, I must say. The original Verdi is quite robust, so I'd read it that those pps are really not very soft (except maybe momentarily).

[sucom]

You played this well and show fluency with your notes, so how to improve it?  At the moment your left hand is competing with your right hand to be heard.  So although you might find it difficult to tone down your left hand at first, if you keep thinking about it while you are playing, it will eventually begin to happen.

Something else I would suggest is to consider triple time.  In three time, the first note is the strongest while the second and third beats are lighter.  I don't know if you have ever danced the waltz, but if you watch a dancer, they sink into the first beat and then go up on the toes for the second and third beats.  You could perhaps think of bouncing a ball.  The first bounce as it hits the ground is the strongest and the next two bounces become progressively weaker.  So I would suggest sinking/leaning into the first beat and then loosening and slightly raising your left wrist (like the drop/slur) technique) for the second and third beats.  This would also apply to the right hand where you have repeated notes, as in the first bar.

Something else you might like to try is phrasing the melody into two bars instead of seeing each bar as a individual box.  For instance, for the first four bars you could say/sing "I like to play this piece, I like to play this piece."  If you think about how you would say this, taking note of the flow of each phrase, it will help your right hand to sound more fluent.  You would naturally put slightly more emphasis on the word 'I' and slightly less emphasis on the words 'like to'.  In the same way, the whole phrase is moving towards the word 'play'. I like to PLAY this piece.  You would naturally lean towards the word 'play' so your hand would be trying to imitate the sound of your voice, moving towards the note representing 'play'.

So if your left hand stops competing with your right hand, and you think of the natural movement of strong/weak/weak in your left hand, and move towards the most important notes (thinking of sentences) this piece will improve immediately.

I hope this helps.

[demimondegirl]

Great advice!