How do you feel about this forum?

[future_maestro]

Do you think this forum is a place where beginners can ask questions and improve their skill by receiving intelligent responses from people who have already walked the road?
Or is it a place where a few claimed good pianists answer simple questions snottily, bash questions that they deem "worthless" and gang up on people who disagree with them?

For me it's more of the latter, but what's your opinion?

[beethovensonata]

Its not for beginners but its okay...

[j_menz]

Do you think this forum is a place where beginners can ask questions and improve their skill by receiving intelligent responses from people who have already walked the road?

You've asked for a copy of the Horowitz version of HR2 and offered opinions on Chopin Etudes and Beethoven Sonatas (including whether other people should/could tackle them). Now you're claiming to be a beginner? 

[swagmaster420x]

i feel like in the online piano community, pianoworld represents the uncultured rabble while pianostreet represents the sophisticated cognoscenti. just kidding (actually not really). here at pianostreet i got called out for calling a piece a song, though, but that was entertaining rather than irritating.

[rachmaninoff_forever]

and if you even think about asking a question about which piece is harder, FORGET about it.  

That's because you can't really answer those questions.  

What's harder?  Appassionata or Waldstein?

Well considering the fact that everyone has different strengths and weaknesses,

HOW THE HECK ARE WE SUPPOSED TO KNOW?!



but ANYWAYS...

I love you guys, and I'll never leave no matter what.

[chopin2015]

how bout that not-well tempered clavier? where are those books for piano, anyways?

[thalbergmad]

For me it's more of the latter, but what's your opinion?

My opinion is that people should actually read the bloody rules before plastering questions, often in the wrong part of the forum. Difficulty questions should be in the student section or in the polls, not in repertoire which is supposed to be for more advance pianists, who are well passed such pointless questions.

If anyone thinks it is better on Pianoworld, they are likely to be disappointed. There are probably even more know it all assholes there.

Thal

[visitor]

My opinion is that people should actually read the bloody rules before plastering questions, often in the wrong part of the forum. Difficulty questions should be in the student section or in the polls, not in repertoire which is supposed to be for more advance pianists, who are well passed such pointless questions.

If anyone thinks it is better on Pianoworld, they are likely to be disappointed. There are probably even more know it all assholes there.

Thal

[g_s_223]

I have been on this forum for nearly ten years now, and for it to have kept my interest that long really does indicate the general excellence of its content.

On virtually all web forums, newbies will get soundly kicked if they manifestly ignore the sub-forum titles and mis-post or cross-post improperly.

In fact, this thread should probably be in The PF Website sub-forum.

[iansinclair]

As internet forums (fora?) go, Pianostreet is one of the best.  There are, indeed, some contributors who are, perhaps, not as helpful as they might be -- but that is common to virtually all internet forums, and this one seems to be beset by fewer of them than most.

There are also on this forum some very very experienced people who seem to be willing to help on a variety of topics and with a variety of aspects of the piano world, whether it is performing or the instruments themselves or whatever.  Sometimes their patience is tested... but they hang in there.

It is rare for me to read a thread (I don't read all of them, though) and not learn something new and useful.

[ted]

I think so too, having been on both forums since 2002. There are good players and good musicians in both places. However, in general there seems to be a greater broadmindedness here, and an acceptance of the right of the individual to a mind of his own at all times. Pianoworld is more oriented along conventionally accepted ways of playing the piano, and traditional modes of how these should occur within society. There is nothing wrong with either approach; it is more a case of personal choice.

Arguments and rudeness are ubiquitous on all forums, but there is a solution which always works for me - simply withdraw from them without comment. I don't know why so few people seem capable of doing this.

[faulty_damper]

I signed up soon after I started playing so I'll be a member for 10 years in less than a week.  I've superseded my former self by thousands of miles, both musically and technically.  I am proud to call myself a musician.  Piano Forum has helped me gain knowledge of many unknown composers.  There's also a lot of guidance on basic techniques that don't make sense until you try it out.  I wish I did several years ago but I was lazy (i.e. I assumed some people were naturally talented and I wasn't.)  It's definitely not for the tourist piano student.

Members come and go and they usually don't return if they leave.

The new crop of members are very young and they don't know how to write clearly, effectively, concisely... In other words, they don't know how to write at all.  I hope their English teachers fail them while simultaneously, they are indirectly admitting that they aren't teaching them how to write.  This new crop of members are also very egotistical.

There are some knowledgeable members who contribute.  Then there are unknowledgeable ones that aren't aware of their unknowledgeableness and they sometimes malign knowledge in an attempt to right.  Thus, they spread misinformation, and at worse, misunderstanding.

I have no other complaints.

[outin]

Like everywhere there are some people who are very fixed in their opinions and have a rather black and white view on things. They don't tend to take it well, if you don't just accept their arguments. That may cause some friction every now and then. Otherwise people quite polite and mostly friendly and helpful. I don't mind the occasional sarcasm or irony, nor the lack of writing skills. If something is not readable, I just don't read it.

[theholygideons]

I hope their English teachers fail them while simultaneously, they are indirectly admitting that they aren't teaching them how to write.

please...,here, in Australian high schools, and possibly in England and whatnot, we just copy essays from the previous graduates, or pay our tutors to fabricate theses or the whole thing for us. But, it's also not the teacher's fault, since they never teach syntax and punctuation properly in school anymore. Thus, the days of parsing sentences and elegant phrasing are long gone.

[iansinclair]

please...,here, in Australian high schools, and possibly in England and whatnot, we just copy essays from the previous graduates, or pay our tutors to fabricate theses or the whole thing for us. But, it's also not the teacher's fault, since they never teach syntax and punctuation properly in school anymore. Thus, the days of parsing sentences and elegant phrasing are long gone.

That's not just Australia.  It's just as true of the USA, if not more so.  I find that some of our members for whom English is not their native language write better than some of those for whom English is; for me it's a matter of figuring out what was meant, which is almost always not a problem.

[future_maestro]

You've asked for a copy of the Horowitz version of HR2 and offered opinions on Chopin Etudes and Beethoven Sonatas (including whether other people should/could tackle them). Now you're claiming to be a beginner? 

No, I'm not claiming to be a beginner. I'm saying for beginners (not referring to myself) although I could be considered a beginner compared to some of the experts on here.

[future_maestro]

My opinion is that people should actually read the bloody rules before plastering questions, often in the wrong part of the forum. Difficulty questions should be in the student section or in the polls, not in repertoire which is supposed to be for more advance pianists, who are well passed such pointless questions.

If anyone thinks it is better on Pianoworld, they are likely to be disappointed. There are probably even more know it all assholes there.

Thal

Ya, like you would know.

[indianajo]

This is why I am PROMPTLY moving over to pianoworld.com, a great forum full of SMART people that will answer any question you have with true honest answers.  Not to mention they have a good website, nothing like this one....

I'm sure some enterprising hacker in Latvia or Belarus is glad you gave pianoworld the password to your retirement account. That is to say your birthdate.  One of these sites you throw your personal information around to will be easy to penetrate, and there goes your savings. 
Of course for the facebook generation, all their finger prints and retina scans will be public too, before they ever think about retiring. 
Pianoworld didn't get my birthdate, and I don't talk or listen to them either.  Neither did facebook or twitter get my birthdate.  The birthdate that for sale on the internet against my name, as provided  to an audio website on their instruction, is fake. 

[pianoplunker]

Do you think this forum is a place where beginners can ask questions and improve their skill by receiving intelligent responses from people who have already walked the road?
Or is it a place where a few claimed good pianists answer simple questions snottily, bash questions that they deem "worthless" and gang up on people who disagree with them?

For me it's more of the latter, but what's your opinion?

All three of your questions are irrelevant - just my opinion

[kevin69]

Do you think this forum is a place where beginners can ask questions and improve their skill by receiving intelligent responses from people who have already walked the road?

yes...

Or is it a place where a few claimed good pianists answer simple questions snottily, bash questions that they deem "worthless" and gang up on people who disagree with them?

...and sometimes yes.

But on the whole its fairly civilised and helpful.
Sometimes there are posts that appear sexist and borderline racist but these may be cultural differences and don't occur often enough to drive me away.

[future_maestro]

I'm sure some enterprising hacker in Latvia or Belarus is glad you gave pianoworld the password to your retirement account. That is to say your birthdate.  One of these sites you throw your personal information around to will be easy to penetrate, and there goes your savings. 
Of course for the facebook generation, all their finger prints and retina scans will be public too, before they ever think about retiring. 
Pianoworld didn't get my birthdate, and I don't talk or listen to them either.  Neither did facebook or twitter get my birthdate.  The birthdate that for sale on the internet against my name, as provided  to an audio website on their instruction, is fake. 

You're totally off subject. Pianoworld doesn't request any info besides name, password, and email. If he was going to give a way his credit card number than maybe you would have a point, but since he isn't, I think that you're over thinking it a little!

[future_maestro]

yes...

...and sometimes yes.

But on the whole its fairly civilised and helpful.
Sometimes there are posts that appear sexist and borderline racist but these may be cultural differences and don't occur often enough to drive me away.

First rational answer... 

[future_maestro]

All three of your questions are irrelevant - just my opinion

What you deem as irrelevant doesn't affect me or anyone else in this world. If it's YOUR opinion, then it only matters to you! KEEP IT!!! 

[indianajo]

You're totally off subject. Pianoworld doesn't request any info besides name, password, and email. If he was going to give a way his credit card number than maybe you would have a point, but since he isn't, I think that you're over thinking it a little!

Glad to hear pianoworld has changed their insecurity policy. Maybe I'll stick my toe in over there.  
Until that change, pianostreet was the only game in town for people living off their savings, IMHO;  However rude some people are here. (they are everywhere, they are everywhere).  Pianostreet is not moderated very effectively, IMHO.  
BTW, if you think a credit card number is the only way to disburse funds without authorization electronically, you should definitely read a general publication like bbcnews.com for a few years before your student loan is paid off. 
A written security policy has nothing to do with what happens on a website illegally.  What data a website does not collect, they can't reveal. 

[future_maestro]

Glad to hear pianoworld has changed their insecurity policy. Maybe I'll stick my toe in over there. 
Until that change, pianostreet was the only game in town for people living off their savings, IMHO;  However rude some people are here. (they are everywhere, they are everywhere).  Pianostreet is not moderated very effectively, IMHO. 

Oh ya, I'm sure that you had read through pianoworlds whole security policy and actually made sense of it! Good luck convincing me or anyone else of that!

[pianoplunker]

What you deem as irrelevant doesn't affect me or anyone else in this world. If it's YOUR opinion, then it only matters to you! KEEP IT!!! 

EXACTLY!  I am glad yo understand what I was saying, even if what I was saying is irrelevant

[kevin69]

I'm sure some enterprising hacker in Latvia or Belarus is glad you gave pianoworld the password to your retirement account. That is to say your birthdate.

If your bank will give someone access to your account based on them knowing your birth date, then i'd switch banks.

[j_menz]

For me it's more of the latter, but what's your opinion?

If it's YOUR opinion, then it only matters to you! KEEP IT!!! 

And the prize for exemplary consistency goes to..........



Someone Else!! 

[swagmaster420x]

know-it-all's that deem every question "stupid" or a "bunch of crap". 
  Lot's of guys on here are snotty,

know-it-alls*
Lots*

[swagmaster420x]

not in repertoire which is supposed to be for more advance pianists, who are well passed such pointless questions.

Thal

past*

[future_maestro]

And the prize for exemplary consistency goes to..........



Someone Else!! 

What the heck are you talking about? "For me it is more of the latter" is referring to the forum, and my comment "If it's YOUR opinion, then it only matters to you! KEEP IT" is referring to the guy who said both questions were irrelevant!

Please read the entire post before you comment on it LOL!

[brogers70]

My experience is that if you ask a clear, specific, and well-formulated question here, you can often get good advice. Lately, though, there do seem to be a few folks who tend to jump in and turn many threads into personal grudge matches with their rivals. Up to a point you can ignore that static, but too much of it starts to turn me off from browsing around here.

[gyzzzmo]

There are experts and idiots on this forum, like on any forum really.
The good thing here is that its quite active, so that you dont have to wait long to decide wich answer belongs to what catagory

[senanserat]

My only complain and that is as a beginner software engineer is that the site is weak to SQL inyection, has a very very "safe" design and that is about it.

People wise, I have been lucky so far in receiving sound advise, constructive criticism and lot of amusement from this monke-people. As a matter of fact I would like to thanks yet again those who have taken the time to ear my less than stellar recordings to provide insight.

It is my hope to someday not far away to be able to return the same kindness I have encountered here. Naturally in every place there're assholes, after all just how the Professor accidentally added the X-chemical to the Powerpuff girl's formula whatever created this universe and world most likely had the same misfortune and dropped a Gazillion of the ASHL- chemic here.

It is also a matter of how easily you get your pompadour in a ruffle.

[senanserat]

Oh and from software and design wise, while this site is lacking pianoworld is so 2004, that it isn't even funny.

[cuberdrift]

I have never really understood the hype against classical fans. I don't actually recall a time I really encountered a classical snob, much less one from this forum which, of my knowledge, is a very informative and reasonable haven from the mountains of mass crap that is the Internet...

...then again I wouldn't class myself as a seasoned musician, so I haven't seen much of this part of society.

[pianoman53]

This forum clearly lost some of its greatness. Before, one could post a recording and have 5 replies within a day, with clear points. There would be discussions about things that mattered, with people who knew what they were talking about.

Now it's self-proclaimed, who wouldn't change their mind if the universe told them to... probably because they would tell themselves that they were the one that invented it.


It's simply a quite lame place now.


(yes, I know. I don't make it better with my sarcastic comments... but so does no one else either)

[beethovensonata]

You've asked for a copy of the Horowitz version of HR2 and offered opinions on Chopin Etudes and Beethoven Sonatas (including whether other people should/could tackle them). Now you're claiming to be a beginner? 

J_menz, I would like to know why  every single damn time when someone asks a question, you focus in and pick them apart on their grammar, or word use.  ANSWER THE FRIKIN' QUESTION!!!!!  DID HE SAY HE WAS A BEGINNER?  NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!   I am sick of your sh*t and so is alot of other people.

[beethovensonata]

And the prize for exemplary consistency goes to..........



Someone Else!! 

Yet another time when your being a DICK.  One copied from a respones to an illiterate person, another asking a question. You are such a dick....Nuff said...

[visitor]

I actually


like Jmenz, I think he's a funny, smart/witty, and not - so -bad dude.

[cometear]

I signed up soon after I started playing so I'll be a member for 10 years in less than a week.  I've superseded my former self by thousands of miles, both musically and technically.  I am proud to call myself a musician.  Piano Forum has helped me gain knowledge of many unknown composers.  There's also a lot of guidance on basic techniques that don't make sense until you try it out.  I wish I did several years ago but I was lazy (i.e. I assumed some people were naturally talented and I wasn't.)  It's definitely not for the tourist piano student.

Members come and go and they usually don't return if they leave.

The new crop of members are very young and they don't know how to write clearly, effectively, concisely... In other words, they don't know how to write at all.  I hope their English teachers fail them while simultaneously, they are indirectly admitting that they aren't teaching them how to write.  This new crop of members are also very egotistical.

There are some knowledgeable members who contribute.  Then there are unknowledgeable ones that aren't aware of their unknowledgeableness and they sometimes malign knowledge in an attempt to right.  Thus, they spread misinformation, and at worse, misunderstanding.

I have no other complaints.

I can only guess you're referring to me.

[cometear]

Yet another time when your being a DICK.  One copied from a respones to an illiterate person, another asking a question. You are such a dick....Nuff said...

It was pretty funny though.

[lostinidlewonder]

This forum used to be very good, after everything started getting discussed and repetition began I think a number of members lost interest. I still see many familiar names of wonderful members who have stayed here over all these the years (hi!!!!!! lol) but it seems many of them also do not want to tackle questions with the gusto we had in the past. There are now a number of annoying idiots on here who talk crap and pretend to be intelligent. Someone stab them please!

Pianostreet is falling behind in terms of social media. I think the old forum style discussions like this are becoming boring and old. I have so much more entertainment on Facebook, it is more alive and action packed, here it is like old grandparents waiting for the kettle to boil or watching something slowly evolve zzzz. There is no proper chat function on pianostreet which is a shame.

[nanabush]

I came to say the same thing  

I joined the forum in 2004!!! I'm not even that old!!!  It just makes me feel old seeing the few members who have 2000+ posts (just breached that not too long ago haha).  People constantly come and go, with honest questions about the hardest piece or the best piece, and we shame them haha.  I joined the forum because I wanted to know how hard a bunch of pieces were (which were at the time MUCH too difficult for me).

I just like that it's become almost a hidden gem.  There is SO MUCH knowledge in the archives of this forum.  When I come on here every once in a while, I feel like I am at this MASSIVE library where just a few people are walking around, reading through all the texts.  You sometimes meet someone who enjoys the same thing as you, but you never have to commit to anything here.  It's a good way for me to just be calm and pass a few hours of time.

I'll be PISSED though when the day comes where this forum gets cut.  Or where everything just gets closed down.  There were some pretty iconic threads from 6-7 years ago that were just hilarious, awesome.  Pianistimo I think her name was??  I've never laughed so hard at some of the arguments she'd get in with people.

I don't know, I like this forum better than Facebook.  I just don't know the people I'm communicating with here haha.

=====

Also:  I joined this forum when I was probably just getting into high school, with no intention of pursuing music.  The only reason I found this place was because on '8notes.com' there was a discussion saying Liszt HR 2 was the "hardest omgz piece evar", and that this website had a discussion about the hardest piece.  At this time, imslp did not exist, and it was a lot harder to find scores online.  I had actually found 'Estrella' by Schumann on sheetmusicarchive.net, after years and years of hearing the piece and having no idea what it was from, and literally did a fist pump in the air.

Everything is just so easy and accessible today, that for some this forum is almost 'too slow' to get good responses.

I'll have to say though, that the genuine people on here and their musical lives really made me think about my life and what I wanted to do... I literally switched degrees, prepared an audition, got into university, completed a Performance Degree, and am now taking a music technology diploma... I taught music for 7 years (from 2007-2014) in a small school near where I used to live... played some chamber music, played at some old folks homes (funnest most relaxed environment to play, awesome audience to play for), got to take a composition class.

That would have NEVER come my way if I didn't go on this forum... I had no support in taking this path from my friends at school or anything, and my family was really just like " do what you want to do ".  So I really can't say anything but 'thanks' to the forum members for being my motivation to steer clear from a career path I definitely would not have enjoyed and would probably be sitting here today saying "oh my god. what have I done" and not remembering how to play piano

[Bob]

Awful lot of spiders around here lately...


MENC/Nafme destroyed its forums several times.  The first two times it had a lot of good info.  All lost.  Extremely stupid on the admin/IT side, although I'm thinking it would have been an admin decision.  After they did that activity hugely declined.  Why post if it would be deleted later?  Why read if nobody was posting?

[classicalnhiphop]

well, we can all agree piano street's layout is a hella lot better than pianoworld's.  Over there, it looks i'm running windows 95

[thalbergmad]

There is a far bigger percentage of arseholes and knowitalls on Piano world.

Thal

[ted]

There is a far bigger percentage of arseholes and knowitalls on Piano world.

Thal

A truth expressed with a succinctness I wouldn't have dared employ. To be fair, it wasn't always the case though.

[mjames]

J_menz, I would like to know why  every single damn time when someone asks a question, you focus in and pick them apart on their grammar, or word use.  ANSWER THE FRIKIN' QUESTION!!!!!  DID HE SAY HE WAS A BEGINNER?  NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!   I am sick of your sh*t and so is alot of other people.

Yet another time when your being a DICK.  One copied from a respones to an illiterate person, another asking a question. You are such a dick....Nuff said...

Lol, bump.

[Bob]

I take it that's not beethovensonata replying to Bernhard, right?  Haha.