Scales with two hands - finger question

[dancook]

I'm new to scale practice, I'm starting with E Major.

I'm already feeling pretty fast on the left, and lightning quick on the right 

But when I put them together, I'm really fighting not to cross over my thumb and forefinger on my right hand to match the digits used on my left half way through the scale.

I assume I should iron this out, and not accept it?

I only ask, because I didn't want to fight it to find out that it's an acceptable alternative or something..

Thanks

[pianoplunker]

I'm new to scale practice, I'm starting with E Major.

I'm already feeling pretty fast on the left, and lightning quick on the right 

But when I put them together, I'm really fighting not to cross over my thumb and forefinger on my right hand to match the digits used on my left half way through the scale.

I assume I should iron this out, and not accept it?

I only ask, because I didn't want to fight it to find out that it's an acceptable alternative or something..

Thanks

I think you should iron this out and accept it all at the same time.  It is what it is, aint going away, it is yours.   Not to be critical, but I can not understand where you need to cross over your thumb. If you are trying to stop that, then just practice that part very slow, not the whole scale, just that part you are fighting

[dancook]

I think you should iron this out and accept it all at the same time.  It is what it is, aint going away, it is yours.   Not to be critical, but I can not understand where you need to cross over your thumb. If you are trying to stop that, then just practice that part very slow, not the whole scale, just that part you are fighting

This is what I'm meant to do..

RH 1,2,3,1,2,3,4,5
LH 5,4,3,2,1,3,2,1

This is what I'm trying to stop

RH 1,2,3,2,1,3,4,5
LH 5,4,3,2,1,3,2,1

When I get to 2 (index finger) on my left hand, my right hand feels compelled to play using it's index finger too, when I'm meant to be using my 1 (thumb). Then I move to thumb on my left hand, and my right hand brings the thumb under to play the next note.

Separately I am play them fine,

I have gone with the slow down during that point and make sure I get it right approach. It's the first night I've tried this, so it's early days yet.

[timothy42b]

There are acceptable alternate fingerings for scales, I can't recall if E has one.   Do a search here for bernhard and alternate fingerings.

It's easy enough to iron these out.  You just spend some time doing the scale two notes at a time, over and over, then the next two notes, all the way up.  Then three notes, four notes, etc.  By the time you finish you'll have it under your fingers.  

[timothy42b]

Just read your post.  Go 121 right, 545 left, as fast as you can, 100 times.  then 232 right, 434 left, same thing.  (if it's easy, do less; if you struggle do more)  All the way up.  Then again 12321 right, 54345 left, etc.  Complete the pattern.  Might take a very long time the first time, and never need to be repeated.

[dancook]

Just read your post.  Go 121 right, 545 left, as fast as you can, 100 times.  then 232 right, 434 left, same thing.  (if it's easy, do less; if you struggle do more)  All the way up.  Then again 12321 right, 54345 left, etc.  Complete the pattern.  Might take a very long time the first time, and never need to be repeated.

Thank you,

So that I understood you correctly - start with the first 2 note of the scale back and forth with both hands, then add in the next note and repeat, and so forth until playing the whole scale.

and thanks pianoplunker for your feedback too.

[lostinidlewonder]

The fact that the position changes occur at different times can make doing scales both hands challenging for the beginner. Try playing lh 54321 and rh 12312. Doing repetitions of this will isolate the rh movement, you can simply play all the fingers in the lh. After this you do the rest, the rh will play 3 and also the lh 3 crossing over and the last two notes are easy. Good luck.

[timothy42b]

Thank you,

So that I understood you correctly - start with the first 2 note of the scale back and forth with both hands, then add in the next note and repeat, and so forth until playing the whole scale.

No, not quite, although you could do that.  But what I meant is start with notes 1 and 2 in both hands, repeat rapidly until comfortable, then change to notes 2 and 3, until you've done the whole scale.  Don't waste time on an easy one, don't move too quick off a hard one.  Some are more awkward than others.  Then start again with notes 1, 2, and 3 in both hands, repeat rapidly until comfortable, then change to notes 2, 3, and 4.  Do the whole scale.  Then notes 1,2,3, and 4.  Etc. 

[pianoplunker]

The fact that the position changes occur at different times can make doing scales both hands challenging for the beginner. Try playing lh 54321 and rh 12312. Doing repetitions of this will isolate the rh movement, you can simply play all the fingers in the lh. After this you do the rest, the rh will play 3 and also the lh 3 crossing over and the last two notes are easy. Good luck.

Great tip

[pianoplunker]

This is what I'm meant to do..

RH 1,2,3,1,2,3,4,5
LH 5,4,3,2,1,3,2,1

This is what I'm trying to stop

RH 1,2,3,2,1,3,4,5
LH 5,4,3,2,1,3,2,1

When I get to 2 (index finger) on my left hand, my right hand feels compelled to play using it's index finger too, when I'm meant to be using my 1 (thumb). Then I move to thumb on my left hand, and my right hand brings the thumb under to play the next note.

Separately I am play them fine,

I have gone with the slow down during that point and make sure I get it right approach. It's the first night I've tried this, so it's early days yet.

You are on the right track to correct that issue. All of the posts I have seen here offer good advice. you just need to break it down and try small chunks at first.