Intense, heart rate maxing exercises?

[Bob]

Running will get me up to about 92% of my max heart rate, for as accurate as that is.

But my heel's sore now so I can't really run.

So how else can I get my heart pumping through exercise?

Bike riding only gets it to a low level of work.  Biking up a hill isn't even hitting a medium amount of work. And I don't have any hills.

Jumping rope -- Gets to a medium-low level.  Nice enough, but not close to max at all.

Stationary inside exercise bike -- Maybe up to a medium-low level if I'm moving weights.

Treadmill -- Gets up to a high-low level which is pretty good, but it's running.  Hurts my heel.

Running in place with high knees -- Gets up to a high-low level.  Good, but it's putting pressure on the feet again, toes more than heels though.


I need to measure other things like jumping jack, burpees, etc.  Something that might do it. 


It's difficult to search for.  Heart, rate, max.... That brings up tons of sites about measurement, what heart rate is, etc., but not exercises on actually hitting max heart rate.  I was searching for intense exercise... It's easier just to ask.


Medium level for me is starting to breath more, sweating some, feeling like it's some amount of work.   Hmm.... Just checked.... What I consider a medium amount is actually 70-80% max heart rate.  Below that seems fairly easy.  65-60-55% max rate seems fairly easy.

High is muscles burning, getting nauseous, possibly seeing colors, breathing hard, sweating hard, etc.  87-92% is what I've hit that feels high to me.  I've only done that with running though.  Even then I hit 94% once and couldn't get it to go any higher.  I was thinking the body is the weaker part since things were burning.  Let the body adjust and eventually the heart would be the weaker part and have to work more.  And then my heel got overused....


Are there any other "intense" exercises?  Esp. ones that don't require pounding down on a heel?

[flashyfingers]

Now, there's an obvious answer to this question...
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sword fighting, or martial arts.

[Bob]

Maybe something like this...

https://www.fitnessblender.com/v/workout-detail/17-Minute-At-Home-Cardio-High-Intensity-Interval-Training-Workout/8l/


A rowing machine or elliptical thing might do it too, except I don't have space (or money) for that.

[flashyfingers]

https://www.arkansas.com/watersports/over-the-water/

[Bob]

I'm on land.  I'm trying to find things that don't require much equipment.

It looks like it's got to be something uses all four limbs though. 

[timothy42b]

Crossfit metcons will do it.

https://www.crossfit.com/

A lot of them use weights or other equipment (pullup bar, rings, etc.) but some don't.

Scroll down here https://www.crossfit.com/cf-info/faq.html#WOD0 and try one of the Girl workouts like Cindy or Fran. 

Or, Fight Gone Bad, that will definitely max your heart rate. 4.3 on the FAQ

[Bob]

Thanks.  I'll check those out.

I think I found a cheap rowing machine that might work.  I've read they're on par with running, but they're beating up the feet.  We'll see.

[Bob]

Thanks for the suggestions.  And to whoever mentioned a rowing machine originally.  I got a really cheap, small rowing machine today.  Tried it out.  Heart rate was about 20-30 bpm above where bike riding is.  I know I hit 80% max for a bit.  I'm thinking if I push it on that it might get even higher.  And if the machine breaks I know it's probably worth investing a little more in a better machine.  Except I don't quite have space...

[Bob]

Interesting...

Weights added doesn't seem to make much of a difference, at least not a first try.

With the rowing machine I can get my heart rate up to 75% and keep it there.  A medium-medium push, breathing sort of heavy, moderate sweating, and the feel of wanting to quit doing that.

[Bob]

Hey, hey.  Success....   My heel is healed enough so I can run on grass.

80% max rate almost right away.

And I actually hit 97-98% but it only felt moderate.  Moderate push, moderate breathing, etc.  Until I stopped.... saw stars... and feel a little queasy now. 



Besides staving off a heart attack or diabetes later and feeling better right now (later on today I'll feel pretty good despite being a little nauseous now), the heart muscle has to be about as basic as it can get for playing the piano. 

[thalbergmad]

I was just bidding on some bike wheels on e bay.

That sent my heart rate up to the max.

Thal

[Bob]

Dripping sweat was another aspect.

And being a little mentally zoned out.  There's something with hitting a certain percent of max heart rate that does that.  Or it's from taking in more air.

[hmrichter]

I second the vote for a martial art.. try Muay Thai or Judo. The more mainstream arts tend to be very over commercialized. Each class will have you getting hit or thrown, conditioning your body. Also in every class (or near that) there should be sparring.. and in a real life situation you can usually hold your own.

[awesom_o]

Now, there's an obvious answer to this question...
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sword fighting, or martial arts.

I do quite a bit of sword fighting... but I have to admit, it is rather dangerous for the hands!

Why not just do swimming?

[Bob]

I'm looking for free too.

Getting hit or thrown would be out.  I already injured myself twice exercising.  So far.

If there were some youtube videos maybe or a series on martial arts.  I'm not sure that's going to get the heart rate really up high though.

[Bob]

Battle ropes... That's another one.

Jump rope, if it works.
Row machine.
Exercise bike set on harder pedaling.



Another injury.  Looking for more ways to increase the heart rate without putting weight on a leg. 


Those are still only getting my heart rate up to medium at the most.  Nothing really seems to beat running.

Probably an elliptical, but I'm not buying one.
Swimming is full body, but I don't see that happening.

[Bob]

Maybe I'm looking for low impact, high intensity cardio....

https://greatist.com/fitness/take-it-easy-21-unexpected-low-impact-workouts
Looks like those characters from the Dumb Ways to Die video have grown up already....

[goldentone]

Maybe you just need to find a sport rather than going the exercise route.  It's a lot more fun than exercising.  Basketball, racquetball, those are high intensity.  Compared to sports, exercise is generic, unexciting, isolating.  With sports we're around people where our need for activity is naturally realized. I think it takes a lot more discipline to exercise per se.  You might find yourself obsessing about it to keep yourself motivated.  When it's a natural part of your life, you can just go with the flow.    

[j_menz]

Looking for more ways to increase the heart rate without putting weight on a leg. 

Scary movies or a tax audit should do it.

[Bob]

Maybe you just need to find a sport rather than going the exercise route.  It's a lot more fun than exercising.  Basketball, racquetball, those are high intensity.  Compared to sports, exercise is generic, unexciting, isolating.  With sports we're around people where our need for activity is naturally realized. I think it takes a lot more discipline to exercise per se.  You might find yourself obsessing about it to keep yourself motivated.  When it's a natural part of your life, you can just go with the flow.    

True and true.  I just don't want to commit to anything like that -- time, scheduling, etc.  Plus I don't know where I'd go.  

And it still wouldn't solve finding things that don't require putting weight on leg (or anything much on one heel like before, if that happens again).  


The interesting thing I see is the global effect.  Just getting the heart pumping pays off in all areas.  I make "free progress" in practicing.  Better healing I think.  I've done nothing different.  I just get more results.  


This doesn't quite count for now.... I was walking with a weight vest on or carrying more weight.  I think that got the heart rate a little higher than normal.  More weight like that may have contributed to the leg thing now though.

I was also thinking about strapping 5 or 10 pounds weights on my legs and trying to move around that way.  The weight's not "on" the leg that way.  Or on the hip at least.  It's under it.  Might be worth a try.  It still probably wouldn't produce much for a heart rate increase though.  

It's always a full body thing.... All four limbs.... Maybe jumping jacks... But on my back.... Add weights.   No pressure on the legs that way.... Haha... "High intensity snow angels."    If it works, it works though.  




She took my idea...     11:38min in this video.

https://www.benderfitness.com/2014/04/30-day-challenge-day-30-15-minute-hiit.html


That's the only other thing I'm coming up with.  Those sets of smaller exercises.  Maybe something like jump rope to increase the rate and then keep it up with that stuff.  Or just time.... After a certain amount of time the heart rate will go up with doing that stuff.  The goal is to get the heart rate into the 'high' range.  Without putting weight on a leg now....


Interesting site.  This stuff looks doable...
https://www.benderfitness.com/


Another idea thief....

[timothy42b]

Maybe you just need to find a sport rather than going the exercise route.  It's a lot more fun than exercising.  

Until you get serious about it.

Then you find you have to do even MORE boring generic exercise to feel like you're okay at the sport. 

[ryankmfdm]

 One of my favorite things to do is jump on the treadmill, set it to the maximum incline at a relatively brisk pace, and just walk it out. It's lower impact than outdoor or even treadmill running, but still gets the heart rate up very effectively.

[visitor]

i use dis

[Bob]

I think I'd pass on that.  Japanese, where do you come up with those ideas....  Looks a little like prancerize.

There is an actual exercise with bouncing on an exercise ball. 

I found another video but the lady looks like she's drugged and barely working at actually exercising. 


Tried to exercise just now.  My leg just laughed and said no though.  Once again... Pain is very motivating.

[goldentone]

And it still wouldn't solve finding things that don't require putting weight on leg (or anything much on one heel like before, if that happens again).  

How long has this been going on?

[Bob]

Over a month now.  I'm blanking on what it felt like initially.

I took a week off though.  Felt like crap.  Exercising does get rid of that.  Although it same feeling as if you stop practicing, somewhat I think

Ran on it again.  That felt good except for the injured part.  That ended up looser and with a little more sharp pain than just the stretch.

I backed off.  Got a bit of a limp though.  Fine whatever...  Except two weeks pass and I've still got the limp.

My hip is loose to some extent.  Muscle that hold the upper bone perfectly in place on one side are that strong.  Something got bumped, stretched, etc. whatever.  So I'm focusing on strengthening the muscles around there now.  Or that's the goal.

Tonight I exercised and after getting the blood flowing walked normally at least over a mile.  Not really feeling anything, but I took some asprin.  I'll know tomorrow.  Plus a heating pad. 

Weak hips, loose muscle from overuse or getting bumped or whatever a month ago... The other thing I found was that limping along for two weeks must have weakened muscles involved in normal walking.  I couldn't freaking walk normal anymore.  When I tried it was still a limp to some extent.  So tonight I figured f-it, the normal walking muscle need a work out too.  Walking can do that.  It might hurt the hip joint muscles/tendons/ligaments a bit but the normal walking muscles can get some recovery.

Annoying though.  After that I ran out of willpower and gave up for the night.  More time to heal though that way.

[Bob]

One of the dumbest revelations from today....

What also gets the heart pumping?  Dribbling a giant exercise ball as fast and as hard as you can.  84% of max heart rate. 

[ahinton]

26 posts on this topic and, despite this being a forum devoted primarily to music, no one has yet mentioned listening to music that is particular powerful and moving as a means to achieve this end without busting oneself up physically.

Hmmm...

Best,

Alistair

[timothy42b]

Bob,
Sounds a bit like iliotibial band syndrome? 

[Bob]

Except it's in the spot where the leg attaches to the torso. 

I think walking a mile actually helped. 

I'm trying to figure out what the big tendon or ligament is called that's in the inner thigh.   That's where it originally started.  When I pushed it a bit for walking normally I noticed that part again.  I can't find what that things called though.  It's a giant leg tendon or ligament though.

[Bob]

Ligament vs. tendon

I guess this is a tendon I'm thinking of then.


I'm going with...
gracilis maybe
Otherwise, probably...
Adductor longus
or
pectineus

And the tendon on that.



Looks like good info, even though it's a sales site....
https://www.aidmymuscle.com/groin-muscle/groin-pulls1.php

[stringoverstrung]

Running will get me up to about 92% of my max heart rate, for as accurate as that is.

But my heel's sore now so I can't really run.

So how else can I get my heart pumping through exercise?

Bike riding only gets it to a low level of work.  Biking up a hill isn't even hitting a medium amount of work. And I don't have any hills.

Jumping rope -- Gets to a medium-low level.  Nice enough, but not close to max at all.

Stationary inside exercise bike -- Maybe up to a medium-low level if I'm moving weights.

Treadmill -- Gets up to a high-low level which is pretty good, but it's running.  Hurts my heel.

Running in place with high knees -- Gets up to a high-low level.  Good, but it's putting pressure on the feet again, toes more than heels though.


I need to measure other things like jumping jack, burpees, etc.  Something that might do it. 


It's difficult to search for.  Heart, rate, max.... That brings up tons of sites about measurement, what heart rate is, etc., but not exercises on actually hitting max heart rate.  I was searching for intense exercise... It's easier just to ask.


Medium level for me is starting to breath more, sweating some, feeling like it's some amount of work.   Hmm.... Just checked.... What I consider a medium amount is actually 70-80% max heart rate.  Below that seems fairly easy.  65-60-55% max rate seems fairly easy.

High is muscles burning, getting nauseous, possibly seeing colors, breathing hard, sweating hard, etc.  87-92% is what I've hit that feels high to me.  I've only done that with running though.  Even then I hit 94% once and couldn't get it to go any higher.  I was thinking the body is the weaker part since things were burning.  Let the body adjust and eventually the heart would be the weaker part and have to work more.  And then my heel got overused....


Are there any other "intense" exercises?  Esp. ones that don't require pounding down on a heel?

Bob, if you are serious about this: don't do this. Going above a certain heart rate is not good for you. It is meant as a reserve for extreme situations that might occur in nature (like having to fight a big cat or bear) when adrenaline takes over.
For the rest don't push your heart rate too high and if you can't do without for one stupid reason or another, don't do it for a long time. It is not good for you.

Especially you create scar tissue on your heart. This year in my country a top professional cyclist was orderd to stop doing high intensity sports for this reason.

Now I know with the internet you can prove anything especially with a directed search but these google results should give you an indication:

https://www.google.be/search?q=max+heart+rate+bad+for+health&oq=max+heart+rate+bad+for+health&aqs=chrome..69i57.8705j0j7&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=93&ie=UTF-8

[Bob]

I don't think I'm in any danger.  Healthy actually.  I'm not exercising enough that it's going to scar my heart up.

[stringoverstrung]

Like the famous PS quote "No editor knows your hand better then yourself" (on fingerings).

I was just worried for the health of revered PS member.

Although my current favourite PS quote remains Ahinton on Hanon by the way:

"One problem that I found with them is that they all require the use of both thumbs and all eight fingers and so there are no digits left to put on one's ears while working at them."


Check the ever-eloquent post at:
https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php?topic=32427.msg583511#msg583511

[ted]

Why bother measuring yourself to that extent Bob ? I think the fashionable preoccupation with pushing oneself to comparative extremes, in exercise, in music, in just about everything, is an unhealthy modern neurosis. My daily training is a wonderful thing, and makes me feel better, no doubt about it. In the same way, I get incomparable joy from working at my music. However, I do not care what measurements other people, "experts" and so on, apply to these things. It isn't a race to the death, I don't need to measure anything or beat anybody in either fitness or music.

Just be self-confident and enjoy your exercise in whatever form suits you. If it makes you feel good, makes you feel well, then it is good; a similar criterion applies to music. Comparisons with what other people do are irrelevant.

[Bob]

It's healthy.  It's just getting my heart rate up a few times a week.  It's fairly difficult to get to the 80-99% range. 

Fortunately I can run again, so that works very well.

Plus the runner's high.  It's up in the higher heat beat range.

It's just basic fitness.  I'm surrounded by lardasses.  I'm not becoming anything like them.

[stringoverstrung]

Why bother measuring yourself to that extent Bob ? I think the fashionable preoccupation with pushing oneself to comparative extremes, in exercise, in music, in just about everything, is an unhealthy modern neurosis. My daily training is a wonderful thing, and makes me feel better, no doubt about it. In the same way, I get incomparable joy from working at my music. However, I do not care what measurements other people, "experts" and so on, apply to these things. It isn't a race to the death, I don't need to measure anything or beat anybody in either fitness or music.

Just be self-confident and enjoy your exercise in whatever form suits you. If it makes you feel good, makes you feel well, then it is good; a similar criterion applies to music. Comparisons with what other people do are irrelevant.

Good point. Be also very careful with your own health data: they can and will be used against you just like everything you say and there is no court of law that will help you escape from the mighty know-alls companies.
Possible applications: use for risk analysis resulting in higher insurance fees for you and your children... The list is endless...
Knowledge is Power. Big data is even more power. Don't give your last private data away. (by putting it on your personal computer or 'smart-device'.)

[Bob]

Haha.  This is bending way out there...

I just wanted exercises that get the heart rate going.  So far that's only running that really does it.  If I ran uphill...  That could be interesting...  Or run with a weight... I tried that a couple times.  I usually can hit 95% if I'm pushing it.  I've only seen 99.99% a couple times, although that involves looking at the heart rate watch.... It's a different environment up there.

No apps or smartphone stuff.  It's just manually checking a watch and confirming, yes, I'm working hard and my heart rate is up. 

[goldentone]

Why bother measuring yourself to that extent Bob ? I think the fashionable preoccupation with pushing oneself to comparative extremes, in exercise, in music, in just about everything, is an unhealthy modern neurosis. . . It isn't a race to the death

You have hit it, Ted.  Marathons are an example of this; they are unnatural and unhealthy.  All you have to do is look at many runners.  The paucity of life's bounty affects all of us, and we have to develop an unnatural self-reliance to survive.  We shouldn't have to.

[Bob]

I'm not doing that much.  I'm thinking around...
10 miles walking/week.  (1+1)*5=10
12 miles running per week.  (1+1)*2*3=12
So 22 miles/week currently, recently upped to this, and it's pushing it a bit.

Spaced out over the week and during days.  I found a way to make that work.
             6 2 6 2 6

Haha... A marathon each week?  If I added a fourth day of running I'd be hitting 26.1 miles....  That sounds a bit nuts to do all that running at once.  I was thinking about that this week.  The wear and tear in a short amount of time doesn't seem worth it.

[timothy42b]

Bob,
You could investigate the Furman plan.

It calls for one speed day, one tempo day, and one slow long distance day a week.

I've used it for years because the days of rest let me heal and prevent injuries.  My brother went on it last year and took an hour off his previous marathon time.

For sheer heart rate maximums it's hard to beat Tabata though.