Fugues

[outin]

It seems if I am going to learn the whole Franck piece in my signature some time in the future, I should start from a much simple fugue... I was thinking of Scarlatti's K93. Or is there something even simpler you'd recommend to start with? No Bach please, his music is not good for my hands.

I could ask my teacher for a piece, but I'd better do my own research first... We've learned that things she choose for me don't always go well...I need to really like the material to be able to work on it long enough to get past the initial stage of learning the notes.

[j_menz]

Bach's little Preludes and Fugues. Many of them aren't by him, so technically not against your rather quaint rule.

There is actually good reason people start with Bach's Fugues, you know.

Scarlatti K93 is OK as an alternative, or the first few of Pachelbel's Fugues on the Magnificat, or GF Handel's HWV 605-10.

For something non baroque, Chopin's Am Fugue is a good starter fugue. Only two parts, too.

[outin]

Bach's little Preludes and Fugues. Many of them aren't by him, so technically not against your rather quaint rule.

There is actually good reason people start with Bach's Fugues, you know.

Scarlatti K93 is OK as an alternative, or the first few of Pachelbel's Fugues on the Magnificat, or GF Handel's HWV 605-10.

For something non baroque, Chopin's Am Fugue is a good starter fugue. Only two parts, too.

My issues with Bach come from the restricted movement of my right thumb, even the simplest inventions are extremely uncomfortable and require weird fingerings and it's just too much work for pieces I don't care for. I've been close to injuring my hand too many times already by trying to play such music with my upright...
I'll look at the little fugues, but if they are as boring as I remember, don't think I can handle them
Chopin...maybe not, I'm seriously thinking of dumping him altogether for similar reasons...need new hands first...

So if the fugue master approves, I think I'll go with Scarlatti. The guy really knew how to write stuff for my hands...

[outin]

I'll look at Handel too, I've kind of neglected him...thanks for the suggestions!

And looked at the Chopin and it's much simpler than I thought and nothing I couldn't handle... and I like the piece, it's kind of lovely in it's weirdness

[visitor]

this is so rad, try this!

[outin]

Not quite my style I'm afraid

But funny you should dig out this thread now... I never got around to study any of the pieces here. So finally last week I actually decided to go straight to the real thing and study the Franck fugue. It's not terribly complicated as a fugue and I'm already used to twisting my fingers around to be able to play his music...

[visitor]

Not quite my style I'm afraid

But funny you should dig out this thread now... I never got around to study any of the pieces here. So finally last week I actually decided to go straight to the real thing and study the Franck fugue. It's not terribly complicated as a fugue and I'm already used to twisting my fingers around to be able to play his music...

no worries and glad you're moving fwd.

i was feeling a bit fuguey earlier so i why  not? 
regarding the lot, when you have a chance do look at the  Kabalevsky fugues as well, they modern but lyrical and charming enough for most and not terribly difficult. will see if i can dig out some videos of them

also j_menz has been mia, so i needed to a little fugue chatter up to the top of the board 

[outin]

no worries and glad you're moving fwd.

i was feeling a bit fuguey earlier so i why  not? 
regarding the lot, when you have a chance do look at the  Kabalevsky fugues as well, they modern but lyrical and charming enough for most and not terribly difficult. will see if i can dig out some videos of them

also j_menz has been mia, so i needed to a little fugue chatter up to the top of the board 

Yes, the Fugue-Master hasn't been around much lately...
But I hope he approves, I'll try to do this the right way, studying the score and writing down the voices separately, not just trying to play it straight away which is what I would normally do. This one will keep me busy for a while though, I don't know why I am so obsessed with this composer when his music is clearly meant for someone with bigger hands 

I have a Kabalevsky prelude on my to do list for this year though.

[visitor]

CF's music is well worth the effort, and we are allowed to 'fake at' having big hands 

i really like the set and they are short so i want to learn them all
the are super charming and effective
   Prelude and Fugue No. 1 in G Major, "A Summer Morning On The Lawn"
        Prelude and Fugue No. 2 in C Major, "Becoming A Young Pioneer"
      Prelude and Fugue No. 3 in E Minor, "An Evening Song Beyond The River"
        Prelude and Fugue No. 4 in A Major, "At The Young Pioneer Summer Camp"
        Prelude and Fugue No. 5 in C Minor, "The Story Of A Hero"
        Prelude and Fugue No. 6 in F Major, "A Feast Of Labour"

[outin]

i really like the set and they are short so i want to learn them all
the are super charming and effective
   

WHY those silly names?? Make me lose my appetite 

[visitor]

WHY those silly names?? Make me lose my appetite  

never been much of a fan for the silly names, too, drives me nuts actually here and with the aweful ones ascribed to Beethoven sonatas and Fred preludes and etudes   , the tunes themselves though are cool nonetheless here's a description from classics today
"...The Six Preludes and Fugues Op. 61 wear their contrapuntal craftsmanship lightly; who else could write a tuneful, waltzing fugue, or a prelude based on clusters that evoke Burt Bacharach covered by The Carpenters...."

[outin]

never been much of a fan for the silly names, too, drives me nuts actually here and with the aweful ones ascribed to Beethoven sonatas and Fred preludes and etudes   , the tunes themselves though are cool nonetheless here's a description from classics today
"...The Six Preludes and Fugues Op. 61 wear their contrapuntal craftsmanship lightly; who else could write a tuneful, waltzing fugue, or a prelude based on clusters that evoke Burt Bacharach covered by The Carpenters...."

That's supposed to increase increase my appetite?

Don't forget I'm a Finn...I need depressing serious music to survive...lightness is kind of a curse word

[visitor]

That's supposed to increase increase my appetite?

Don't forget I'm a Finn...I need depressing serious music to survive...lightness is kind of a curse word

fair enough and understood.

you can sprinkle in a little dash this to the mix, short/small enough to tack on to top or back end of whatever you're working on

[outin]

you can sprinkle in a little dash this to the mix, short/small enough to tack on to top or back end of whatever you're working on

I'll see if I find the sheet music somewhere...that's not quite the same as doing Bach, right?

[visitor]

I'll see if I find the sheet music somewhere...that's not quite the same as doing Bach, right?

let me know if you hit a wall i think i have the entire dk piano output in my archives (save one large scale Bach transcription that evades me for years)

[outin]

let me know if you hit a wall i think i have the entire dk piano output in my archives (save one large scale Bach transcription that evades me for years)

On the other hand I really don't have room on my piano for extra pieces now...even this fugue is just a side project. If I ever finish it there are a few more I really would like to do. Bach's are not on that list really...

[roncesvalles]

At IMSLP (https://imslp.org/wiki/111_Canons_in_All_Minor_and_Major_Keys_(Reger,_Max)), there is an early work by Max Reger called 111 Canons in All Minor and Major keys.   They are split into two sections, two voice canons and three voice canons.   There are quite a few really cool ones, and a great many ones playable who might not be ready to tackle Bach yet.   

[outin]

At IMSLP (https://imslp.org/wiki/111_Canons_in_All_Minor_and_Major_Keys_(Reger,_Max)), there is an early work by Max Reger called 111 Canons in All Minor and Major keys.   They are split into two sections, two voice canons and three voice canons.   There are quite a few really cool ones, and a great many ones playable who might not be ready to tackle Bach yet.   

For some reason I've always disliked canons...

[brogers70]

Handel has a keyboard suite in e minor which begins with a fugue

https://imslp.org/wiki/Suite_in_E_minor,_HWV_429_%28Handel,_George_Frideric%29

The rest of the suite is lovely, too.

[outin]

Studying my first fugue is actually quite fun. I'm half way into identifying and writing down the 4 voices in Musescore. I've fingered the first page, but the most challenging parts are still ahead. I really wish I had bigger hands, I won't be able to do justice to all the voices...but I guess one has to work with what one has...have to do more leg work then...

I'm glad there's an organ score available with 3 clefs. Makes it much faster to find the voices in the messier measures

[dcstudio]

I'll look at the little fugues, but if they are as boring as I remember, don't think I can handle them
Chopin...maybe not, I'm seriously thinking of dumping him altogether for similar reasons...need new hands first...

little fugues?

I thought they were for the organ, 

chopin...fugues?

or are you dumping bach for chopin--thinking it's easier?


I avoided JSB...   for decades..    there is something very fundamental about playing a keyboard instrument that only comes from studying the "fuguemeister" though--that's why he's required learning.   For me after I gave in and started playing that stuff again---it was a very heightened independence between my hands.  An ability to think for both my hands at once...  to listen to more than one melody...   

of course... some folks just don't like him...  and that's ok.

Play what makes you happy really...  or you will never stick with it.

just don't be trashin my man johann   

[outin]

little fugues?

I thought they were for the organ, 

chopin...fugues?

or are you dumping bach for chopin--thinking it's easier?


I avoided JSB...   for decades..    there is something very fundamental about playing a keyboard instrument that only comes from studying the "fuguemeister" though--that's why he's required learning.   For me after I gave in and started playing that stuff again---it was a very heightened independence between my hands.  An ability to think for both my hands at once...  to listen to more than one melody...   

of course... some folks just don't like him...  and that's ok.

Play what makes you happy really...  or you will never stick with it.

just don't be trashin my man johann   

I never really went out with Bach so I was thinking of dumping Chopin. Only because of my hands.
I've tried Bach many times but we never get along...So I always return to my old Baroque man, Scarlatti, his music fits my hands like a glove. Think I'll finish all his sonatas first, then maybe I will look into Bach again 

[dcstudio]

I never really went out with Bach so I was thinking of dumping Chopin.

yes I understand completely--I did date Bach for a brief time in my youth..and I was betrothed to him when I was in college....an arranged thing..lol. .it didn't work out....but now we are trying to give it another go.. I discovered that I barely knew him before... he's not nearly the monster I remember from when I was young.

I have always been pretty faithful to my guy Beethoven...  though he may not agree--we have had our problems as well...but I just keep coming back...no matter how badly I get hurt. 

There is no one though who moves my heart like Fred...  I was afraid of him for the longest time---but now he and I get along quite nicely.   We understand each other...lol.

after 46 years of silently screaming at my mental projections of dead composers as I try to play their music...  they now have fully developed personalities in my head.......call me crazy


 

[brogers70]

That's supposed to increase increase my appetite?

Don't forget I'm a Finn...I need depressing serious music to survive...lightness is kind of a curse word

I'd forgotten you were a Finn. Do you listen to the news in Latin? Do the tango? Those are things I had heard were very popular in Finland, but I wonder if it's really true.

[outin]

There is no one though who moves my heart like Fred...  I was afraid of him for the longest time---but now he and I get along quite nicely.   We understand each other...lol.

I kind of understand him too, when I listen to his music. I can even share his experiences with a suffocating lung disease
But playing it is too much struggle except for a few exceptions...

[outin]

I'd forgotten you were a Finn. Do you listen to the news in Latin?

I have no idea what you are talking about? 

Do the tango? Those are things I had heard were very popular in Finland, but I wonder if it's really true.

Well, I personally will choose some funky dance music over tango, but I guess some people here are much into it...but you should know that the Finnish "tango" has little to do with Argentina...

[dcstudio]

I kind of understand him too, when I listen to his music. I can even share his experiences with a suffocating lung disease
But playing it is too much struggle except for a few exceptions...

he had the heart and mind of a jazzer--went to a party --improvised the Opus 66 then came home and wrote it down.

I have played many, many, parties...   and I improvise a lot at that kind of gig...  and I come home and write stuff out too...   though nothing like the opus 66..lol.. but in some small way... I get him.

[brogers70]

I have no idea what you are talking about? 

A few years back there was a story on the radio here about how Finland was the country where the study of Latin was most popular in the world, and that there were radio stations in Finland that broadcast the news in Latin. They even had an excerpt - the story of the release of Nelson Mandela from prison, spoken entirely in Latin. I love Latin, myself, so I was impressed that somewhere in the world it was so popular people liked to hear their news in Latin. But obviously the story seems to have exaggerated a bit.

Anyway, happy fugueing.

[outin]

But obviously the story seems to have exaggerated a bit.

A bit maybe

Some of my friends did study latin in school, but mostly it's just English and the compulsory Swedish, German, Russian or French. Some schools do offer Latin, but it's not something that common.

There are no special radio channel but it is true that the state broadcasting company does offer weekly news in several languages and Google just told me latin is among them