Gay rights

[rachmaninoff_forever]

I hate gay people gay people shouldn't be married this is disgusting.
















Just kidding. 

But yeah man people ACTUALLY think like this.  It's not like you have to go to their wedding or anything.  If you don't like gay marriage, don't marry a gay dude.  Or girl.  What other people do ok private is none of your concern.  Yeah about time gay people can get married though.  Good job America.

[outin]

Good job America.

It's a rare occasion to see the Americans ahead of us in rationality, so good job indeed!

[thalbergmad]

The tambo bangers grip on the people of America appears to be decreasing.

However, it appears to have been a close shave.

Thal

[Bob]

Equal rights, political correctness, yadda yadda yadda.... I was going to say at least we won't have to hear about people arguing about that in the news.  It seems like something from a few generations back.  Marry whoever you want.  I don't care.

(They've got the not-actually-Confederate flag to ban to solve the world's problems now.  )

And then this...
https://gawker.com/alabama-county-stops-issuing-marriage-licenses-all-toge-1714220263
Haha.  Not really discrimination if they just stop offering the service all together I guess. 
Way to go Alabama. 

[chopinlover01]

Equal rights, political correctness, yadda yadda yadda.... I was going to say at least we won't have to hear about people arguing about that in the news.  It seems like something from a few generations back.  Marry whoever you want.  I don't care.

(They've got the not-actually-Confederate flag to ban to solve the world's problems now.  )

And then this...
https://gawker.com/alabama-county-stops-issuing-marriage-licenses-all-toge-1714220263
Haha.  Not really discrimination if they just stop offering the service all together I guess. 
Way to go Alabama. 

"When he's not quoting scripture on Twitter"
Why am I not surprised... Oh right, because it's Alabama, and because he appears to be a fundamentalist Christian. 

[cuberdrift]

Well, my dad used to say, if someone believes he's a woman inside the body of a man, why doesn't there seem to be anyone who believes he's a dog inside the body of a man?

Perhaps in the future, it's okay to marry your dog, too.  

[swagmaster420x]

Well, my dad used to say, if someone believes he's a woman inside the body of a man, why doesn't there seem to be anyone who believes he's a dog inside the body of a man?

Perhaps in the future, it's okay to marry your dog, too. 

Just like the classic, "if humans evolved from monkeys, why do monkeys still exist?"

[stoat_king]

Something baffles me about homophobia.
"Im imagining what you get up to in private - and I dont like what I'm seeing!"

Well, my dad used to say, if someone believes he's a woman inside the body of a man, why doesn't there seem to be anyone who believes he's a dog inside the body of a man?

As a man trapped in a womans body, which is in turn trapped in a mans body, I feel that I am well placed to respond to your dad: "Shut up"

[chopinlover01]

Well, my dad used to say, if someone believes he's a woman inside the body of a man, why doesn't there seem to be anyone who believes he's a dog inside the body of a man?

Because humans have a higher intelligence than dogs, and we don't typically think in their way of "I like treats and I like being petted and I like to run".
We're social animals. We connect to each others. Dogs are not, primarily, a social animal.
_{Perhaps your dad could actually do some research on transgenders before making a narrow minded statement such as that.}
I have numerous friends who are transgenders, and have just gotten to an extremely low tolerance point for this nonsense 

[swagmaster420x]

I guess he's just one of those simpleminded people who somehow equate homosexuality with bestiality and all those other unrelated kinks 

[cuberdrift]

As a man trapped in a womans body, which is in turn trapped in a mans body, I feel that I am well placed to respond to your dad: "Shut up"

How many transformations have you actually been through...? 

Because humans have a higher intelligence than dogs, and we don't typically think in their way of "I like treats and I like being petted and I like to run".

What person doesn't like treats, and for that matter, who doesn't like being petted? And lots of people like to run.

Maybe if someone has all three traits, along with say, a fondness for meat foods, maybe he'll want to believe he is a dog with a man's body, and start barking and growling, etc. lol.

People are entitled to their own opinions and beliefs, even though some may strike others as ridiculous.

Perhaps your dad could actually do some research on transgenders before making a narrow minded statement such as that.

Maybe he just saw the statement as ludicrous. But believe me, he was far from 'narrow minded'. He was an Arts Studies professor who discussed everything as part of culture, so I think he did understand the viewpoint of transgenders.

We both understood that there is no REAL dividing line between a 'male and female' character, hence it is perhaps silly to say that one is 'a woman in a man's body'. If I loved sushi and was Indian, would I tell you that I'm actually a Japanese trapped in an Indian's body?

[chopinlover01]

There's a difference between loving Sushi and being indian than being transgender.\
Here's a simplistic overview of how it works.
Some people are born male, and feel/have the brain of an average (or not so average) male.
Some people are born female, and feel/have the brain of an average (^) female.
Some people are born male, and are attracted to females, and vice versa.
Some people are born female, and are attracted to females, and vice versa for the opposite gender.
Just as sexuality isn't a choice, just as it is an innate part of who we are, gender applies in this manner. Some people are born male and feel male, some people are born female and feel female, some people are born male and feel female (and vice versa).
To equate this to the simplistic dogs view (after all, dogs don't pray to any higher power, nor do they kill for fun, torture for fun, or engage in cannabilism most of the time, as we humans do) is ridiculous. We as humans (though we've gone and squandered our gifts pretty badly) have brains that are capable of many things, and sometimes by accident of birth you're born male and feel female inside.
Honestly, it just is what it is IMHO. I don't really care whether someone wants to be called Bruce or Caitlyn, I'll call them whichever they prefer, just as if you had a nickname you preferred to go by, I'd call you by that.
The main people opposing these people happen to be (and this is fairly objective; if you look at the people stopping transgender rights it's mainly) religious folk. They object because their holy book teaches them that it is wrong- perhaps because it was written over a thousand years ago before we had the knowledge of these things, haha.

[cuberdrift]

There's a difference between loving Sushi and being indian than being transgender.\

Maybe, but somehow, there's a similarity, too. In the sushi example the subject believes that a taste for sushi is a Japanese trait, while perhaps the transgender believes liking people his own gender is an opposite gender's trait. Both feel they are different from what they, physically, are.

And by the way, if I didn't like garlic on my food, does that mean I am a vampire on a human's body? lol  .

Just as sexuality isn't a choice, just as it is an innate part of who we are, gender applies in this manner. Some people are born male and feel male, some people are born female and feel female, some people are born male and feel female (and vice versa).

Is a taste for sushi or a revulsion to garlic a choice, or is it an "innate part of who we are"? I'm not sure myself, actually.

To equate this to the simplistic dogs view (after all, dogs don't pray to any higher power, nor do they kill for fun, torture for fun, or engage in cannabilism most of the time, as we humans do) is ridiculous. We as humans (though we've gone and squandered our gifts pretty badly) have brains that are capable of many things, and sometimes by accident of birth you're born male and feel female inside.

Well, except if it's what I said. If I persist on believing I'm Darth Vader re-incarnated because I find it hard to tolerate my subordinates' incompetence, you'll be hard-pressed to convince me otherwise. 

The main people opposing these people happen to be (and this is fairly objective; if you look at the people stopping transgender rights it's mainly) religious folk. They object because their holy book teaches them that it is wrong- perhaps because it was written over a thousand years ago before we had the knowledge of these things, haha.

Although we are not what you might identify as 'religious' folk, I see your point. It's tough to re-interpret something that is "divinely-inspired". There is much moral confusion these days, soo much that it sometimes just isn't worth your time anymore debating about it. What is important is that you live a happy, healthy life and treat others like yourself.

[chopinlover01]

(will make a second post tomorrow addressing your points)
I've always substituted the golden rule for "Don't be a dick".
Pretty simple stuff.
My issue with the golden rule, "Treat others as you would treat yourself" (though I've heard "as you want to be treated", and that works fine) is that the entire thing just seems really flowery and all sunshine and rainbows. I prefer the more concise clear language- and it also closes the loophole of "Well I engage in self mutilation, so I can I walk up and stab this dude?" caveat (though that one hardly seems to come up anymore.

[cuberdrift]

(will make a second post tomorrow addressing your points)

Ahh forget it. It was just really funny hearing about the dog thing. Don't take my viewpoints way too seriously.

I've always substituted the golden rule for "Don't be a dick".
Pretty simple stuff.

But I am a 'dick'. 

Just kidding. Yeah, pretty much.

My issue with the golden rule, "Treat others as you would treat yourself" (though I've heard "as you want to be treated", and that works fine) is that the entire thing just seems really flowery and all sunshine and rainbows. I prefer the more concise clear language- and it also closes the loophole of "Well I engage in self mutilation, so I can I walk up and stab this dude?" caveat (though that one hardly seems to come up anymore.

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes" or whatever. Come on, you now what I was trying to say.

We can't be moralistic about other cultures, as my father once taught.

[swagmaster420x]

Ahh forget it. It was just really funny hearing about the dog thing. Don't take my viewpoints way too seriously.

Lol

[chopinlover01]

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes" or whatever. Come on, you now what I was trying to say.

We can't be moralistic about other cultures, as my father once taught.

God, that movie was awful. Episode 3 blew..
actually, there's an interesting discussion (though you've probably seen it and perhaps posted in it) started by our Rach loving friend about whether morals are related to culture or not.

[kevonthegreatpianist]

There's nothing wrong being gay. :/

[kevonthegreatpianist]

(will make a second post tomorrow addressing your points)
I've always substituted the golden rule for "Don't be a dick".
Pretty simple stuff.
My issue with the golden rule, "Treat others as you would treat yourself" (though I've heard "as you want to be treated", and that works fine) is that the entire thing just seems really flowery and all sunshine and rainbows. I prefer the more concise clear language- and it also closes the loophole of "Well I engage in self mutilation, so I can I walk up and stab this dude?" caveat (though that one hardly seems to come up anymore.

Oh, but I have a big dick.

jk

I also have an issue with the golden rule. Does that mean that if you enjoy being abused and raped (although why?), you have the right to abuse and rape other people?
 

[Bob]

I remember hearing about the slippery slope of what happens when two guys or two girls could marry....

People would also marry dogs or animals.   ...Except we can't ever be sure for sure an animal wanted to get married.  They can't communicate that to anyone for sure.

Polygamy.  That would be interesting.  I wouldn't mind hearing about that in the news just for the entertainment value.  Instead of marriage is between a man and woman (however they're determining that), I would think marriage is now between any two people.  But then there are the polygamists.  So... What about a marriage of three people to keep it small?  Or a hundred on the other extreme? 

[compline]

Without prejudice.

 Ok enlighten me.  I have never really understood what this  'Gay Rights' is all about.  What don't they get that we heterosexuals are getting already?  

As far as I know gay partners have always been treated equal, they have a recognized civil partnership living as a couple treated with the same rights as married heterosexual couples? I'm fine with that,  So what more can they want? Why do they make they single themselves out and make a special case?  

[swagmaster420x]

Without prejudice.

 Ok enlighten me.  I have never really understood what this  'Gay Rights' is all about.  What don't they get that we heterosexuals are getting already?  

As far as I know gay partners have always been treated equal, they have a recognized civil partnership living as a couple treated with the same rights as married heterosexual couples? I'm fine with that,  So what more can they want? Why do they make they single themselves out and make a special case?  

Separate but "equal" is patently unequal. It makes no sense to say that a civil partnership is the same as marriage, or even to say that it has the same rights as marriage.
When people make arguments like this I'm not sure if they just have bad logic/lack of human understanding and genuinely believe in it or they're just uncomfortable with the attention created by homosexuals campaigning for themselves.

Also, your use of the word "they" is one of those things that just really grates on me personally. For example, Feminists and non feminists will talk like this about the other side all the time as if the other side is somehow inherently inhumane/unreasonable in some respect. The bottom line is that all people are fundamentally pretty much the same. They don't respond well to an other side and tend to lash out when they perceive themselves as being treated unfairly. From this simple character trait alone, it's obvious why "they single themselves out and make a special case." Homosexuals see themselves in an unfair situation, which is a founded viewpoint, so they band together and try to reverse it by making their sexuality a point of pride. I'm fairly sure if you experienced what "they" did, you would act very similar to them. Don't use the word "they" as if you're actually above something wrong that "they're" doing. It's actually quite arrogant.

[compline]

Well , no need to bite my head off!
I'm sorry that referring to homosexuals or same sex partners,   as 'they', it was never my intention to irritate or use it in a derogatory sense!  Further more, I most certainly do not put myself above people that have same sex attraction, how dare you accuse me of that!  

I  know and have enjoyed  working  and meeting with  'homosexuals' , if that's what you want me to now say, instead of using the word, they or them.   I actually have enjoyed my time working with them, they were always the most helpful,  oops, I said 'them'.   shame on me!  
Perhaps the American political system is different to  the UK, but they do have equal rights here.

Get over your hissy fit!

[swagmaster420x]

Haha, I made some pretty unreasonable statements. I'm sorry for being offensive but online I'm always feel like starting ****. You left yourself open by seeming to think that campaigning for gay marriage is simply making a fuss when civil unions exist.

[compline]

Why is it that this Gay Rights subject is so sensitive that folks have to tread on eggshells afraid of asking questions or commenting on the plight of so called hard done my same sex partners?  

I just got flamed and  pretty well wrongly accused of being  homophobic or some bloody thing.

Goodbye,  I'm not missing much here.

[swagmaster420x]

Uhhh peace

[senanserat]

I don't rightly care what people do so long its consensual. The only thing that bothers me pretty much, and read before someone throws me a chair is the following argument;

"Gay is unnatural" or some stuff along that lines.
"Animals do it too, its in nature" or something like that.

Right? But then we have the classical argument of:

"Don't do that (i.e eat certain way) you're not an animal! "
"Humans are better than animals for X or Y"

So which one is it?

The only thing that bothers me is the excuse/argument/whatever. Can we just accept that people love/lust the same sex and move on?

[senanserat]

I remember hearing about the slippery slope of what happens when two guys or two girls could marry....

People would also marry dogs or animals.   ...Except we can't ever be sure for sure an animal wanted to get married.  They can't communicate that to anyone for sure.

Polygamy.  That would be interesting.  I wouldn't mind hearing about that in the news just for the entertainment value.  Instead of marriage is between a man and woman (however they're determining that), I would think marriage is now between any two people.  But then there are the polygamists.  So... What about a marriage of three people to keep it small?  Or a hundred on the other extreme? 

Wait a couple years and we may have protest of polygamy XD

Now that will be amusing to watch, specially if they get their way and realise they have to pay immense child support or/and they cannot give out enough quality time.

[blackonwhite]

My freaking god that was funny at the first comment all I could see was the homophobic comment and not the just kidding because I was at the top of the page but anyways.

I think that same-sex marriage should be allowed there is nothing wrong with it, and it being legal happened by surprise it I didn't see it coming

[swagmaster420x]

I don't rightly care what people do so long its consensual. The only thing that bothers me pretty much, and read before someone throws me a chair is the following argument;

"Gay is unnatural" or some stuff along that lines.
"Animals do it too, its in nature" or something like that.

Right? But then we have the classical argument of:

"Don't do that (i.e eat certain way) you're not an animal! "
"Humans are better than animals for X or Y"

So which one is it?

The only thing that bothers me is the excuse/argument/whatever. Can we just accept that people love/lust the same sex and move on?

The natural argument also sucks because pedophilia is natural.