Extreme beginner. Time required to play Beethoven concerto and chopin etudes

[bala12345]

Hi. Extreme beginner here. I just had a session of just one hour on my new piano. So I just played two hours up to now my entire life on piano. Lol. I'm just wondering how long it might take for one to play Beethoven 4th or 5th piano concerto completely? Also how long it would take for one to play Chopin etudes? If any of you guys have mastered these stuffs how long did it take you to play the same. (Considering the moment you touched the piano). How many months, years etc? Thanks.

[dcstudio]

...trust me...you don't want to know.     

[diomedes]

Depends on the individual almost 100%, mental acuity etc. Work habits and determination over a large span of time are also factors.

If you're average, fairly young and work like a slave, maybe..... 5 years? There are too many unknown variables to tell, to be totally bland. Mind you some of the Chopin Etudes are the most intimidating music in the entire piano literature.

[mjames]

It's not about how much time you spend on the piano, it's about how well you practice. Not saying that you can't appreciate these works, but it's best that you put in some more approachable goals for now.

Your goal for the year should be: "Learn all of Bach's inventions!"

[bala12345]

Thanks a lot Diomedes and mjames. Oh 5 years is not that bad.  And mjames. Is it really possible to master bach's inventions in just about a year.That is so cool  . I've heard people saying stories about how Bach's left hand parts are insane. I'll look into the inventins in a while. Thanks again 

[mjames]

I didn't say 'master', I said that it's possible to learn them all. Besides, the inventions were intended as an exercise/introduction in to contrapuntal music. They're meant for 'beginners.' Not beginners in the sense of, well, you just picked up the piano a hours ago. But imo, it should be studied or at least looked at during the early stages. Have fun...

 

[michael_c]

Thanks a lot Diomedes and mjames. Oh 5 years is not that bad.

That was with the qualification "If you're average, fairly young and work like a slave". I'd say you'd need to have more than average talent and be putting in around 5 hours a day of efficient practice to get that far in five years.

Look into some nearer goals. See where playing the piano takes you. The journey itself is the reward.

[dcstudio]

The journey itself is the reward.

journey shmourney

...hmmmm... yadda yadda yadda  ---lol...don't believe him for a second bala---the reward is the thrill of feeling your fingers fly over the keyboard almost faster than you can see them--the feeling of balance as they strike each note precisely as you intend--the excitement of  knowing that at that moment you are a pianist doing what you were meant to do and you are the one bringing this piece to life--the absolute rush of an emotional connection with the other musicians and the audience or with the music and at times the composer as well--the giddy feeling you get while you break out in goose bumps during a performance--and sometimes--if you are lucky... on occasion--seeing that look of total amazement -- of shock and awe--- of total joy---in someone's eyes who has been listening.  Knowing that it was your playing that inspired that kind of reaction... is pretty cool... at times it's a little overwhelming even.

It's been 46 years btw since I first touched a piano...  how long did it take me..? about 46 years.  


never give up...  

[diomedes]

Mark my words carefully, there are too many variables at work. I followed up the 5 years statement with a I have no idea.

Although facts can be fun:
Evidently, if what I read was correct arnaldo Cohen didn't really play the piano until he was 21, and eventually ended up winning the Busoni competition. Doesn't sound like he's average in some ways, but then, what do we know?

[bala12345]

Thanks guys. Yeah whatever u said definitely makes sense. I can just devote an hour or two for my piano practice because of work n stuff. May be I may take even longer than 5 years. But I'll never give up. Thanks for the inspiration.
I started playing fur Elise now ( just the beginning part) and I'm finding it so hard to synchronize left and right hand. But surely I'm having so much fun playing the piano. I'm so excited to start the wonderful journey of my life playing the piano.

[outin]

Also how long it would take for one to play Chopin etudes?

All of them? Depending on what you mean with "play" I would say for 99,9% of adult beginners (disclaimer: This is not a scientifically proven figure) it would take more than one lifetime...Possible maybe, but there are usually just too many variables working against you. So try to find some enjoyable pieces that are slightly more accessable and make them your goal.

[bala12345]

Oh. Thanks for your comment. I actually like them all. But my favorites are  op.10 no. 1 and 4. I know they are the toughest but I just love the composition. I like the 3rd one too, op.10. I have pollini's interpretations and I just love them. I think after a few years down the line I guess I'll have to start with the 3rd one and move on from there. Is pretty understandable that it might take a lifetime to play in that correct tempo. Maybe in a much slower tempo people may play it I guess.  Just so excited to start my journey in playing the piano.

[adodd81802]

All of them? Depending on what you mean with "play" I would say for 99,9% of adult beginners (disclaimer: This is not a scientifically proven figure) it would take more than one lifetime

Sorry just reading this... I appreciate the "This is not a scientifically proven figure" but the statement itself is a far from being accurate. Weren't 100% of us all beginners at one stage? My first real listen to Chopin was Idil Biret who played the complete works of Chopin starting a beginner at the age of 5. I appreciate the learning pace may be difficult as an adult but it is silly to suggest the right practicing cannot achieve the same, if not more as an adult.

If you practice right and you want to practice, anything is achievable.

So you have first said you're an absolute beginner. I would say it would be unreasonable to assume you could just jump in at the Etudes you'd struggle. It's like having a crash lesson in driving then jumping into Formula 1 there has to be sensible, theoretical practice.

Fur Elise on the whole is considered a Grade 4 piece. My advise would be this, if you do not want to go down the piano teacher route whether it's financial reasons or simply your level of interest, then go onto the Royal School of Music website and check their syllabus, they advise what an exam would consist of and the accepted pieces to play. Go to grade 1, and work from there, find the pieces, learn some scales get a real understanding for the piano.

Average yourself at a grade a year assuming you can only put 1-2 hours of studying a day if that. A big part of learning the practical of the piano is understanding the theory behind it. understand why you're doing something, ensure you're learning the right way.

The Etudes can become part of a bigger goal so when it comes to actually learning the songs you're not just reading notes and pressing keys, you're getting a true feel for the music. If you don't believe you can have that passion, then I would say learning the piano isn't for you.

I 100% support anybody that decides to pick up an instrument and believe anything can be achieved with a sensible approach.

[dcstudio]

 Is pretty understandable that it might take a lifetime to play in that correct tempo. Maybe in a much slower tempo people may play it I guess. 

maybe...  but as a person who has spent a lifetime at it ...  I realize that I put restrictions like this on myself early on...    those restrictions really held me back at times.   My pre-conceived notions of what is meant to be a pianist--what I had to know--what I had to be able to do --how I had to think--what it would feel like to be able to play at a very advanced level....well....they were all WAY OFF...  lol.  I had trouble letting go of the "fantasy" for a while..

there is this "neurosis"

[outin]

Sorry just reading this... I appreciate the "This is not a scientifically proven figure" but the statement itself is a far from being accurate. Weren't 100% of us all beginners at one stage? My first real listen to Chopin was Idil Biret who played the complete works of Chopin starting a beginner at the age of 5. I appreciate the learning pace may be difficult as an adult but it is silly to suggest the right practicing cannot achieve the same, if not more as an adult.

If you practice right and you want to practice, anything is achievable.

So you have first said you're an absolute beginner. I would say it would be unreasonable to assume you could just jump in at the Etudes you'd struggle. It's like having a crash lesson in driving then jumping into Formula 1 there has to be sensible, theoretical practice.

Fur Elise on the whole is considered a Grade 4 piece. My advise would be this, if you do not want to go down the piano teacher route whether it's financial reasons or simply your level of interest, then go onto the Royal School of Music website and check their syllabus, they advise what an exam would consist of and the accepted pieces to play. Go to grade 1, and work from there, find the pieces, learn some scales get a real understanding for the piano.

Average yourself at a grade a year assuming you can only put 1-2 hours of studying a day if that. A big part of learning the practical of the piano is understanding the theory behind it. understand why you're doing something, ensure you're learning the right way.

The Etudes can become part of a bigger goal so when it comes to actually learning the songs you're not just reading notes and pressing keys, you're getting a true feel for the music. If you don't believe you can have that passion, then I would say learning the piano isn't for you.

I 100% support anybody that decides to pick up an instrument and believe anything can be achieved with a sensible approach.

I also 100% support anyone who decides to learn to play.

And of course it would be wonderful if anything was possible but I just know it isn't. And I was talking stricly about an ADULT beginner, of course every pianist has been a beginner at some point. But it's just very different when you start as a child. An adult has a different mentality, a lot of baggage and LIFE tends to get in the way. Also this level of piano music does require some physical and mental aptitude that many people simply do not possess.

To be able to play these 2 sets of etudes to a reasonable standard isn't just about keeping at it for a certain number of hours or years or moving up grade by grade. If it was so, there would be a lot of amateur pianists who can manage them. Yet there are only a handful and EVERYONE I have encountered has studied piano since childhood. or early teens. Feel free to prove my estimated 99,9% wrong by examples

This does not mean that one cannot learn a lot of demanding music as an adult beginner. I could now certainly handle some of the technical difficulties in the etudes with practice and help from my teacher, but what those etudes require as a set is still light years away from that.

I am a realist and do not find it discouraging at all to have found this understanding. I honestly thought a bit like you do in the beginning, it was due learning more that I started understanding the demands better as well. The more you know the more you understand your shortcomings, as they say... I still think that I will learn some of them at some point, if I live long enough. But they don't seem that important to me anymore, since I have found plenty of other stuff that I want to play just as much

I am fairly certain that similar change will happen in OP if he really does do all the ground work needed. That may be one reason why adult beginners do not learn the whole sets: They realize that the time invested is much better spent on a more varied repertoire.

[bala12345]

So you have first said you're an absolute beginner. I would say it would be unreasonable to assume you could just jump in at the Etudes you'd struggle. It's like having a crash lesson in driving then jumping into Formula 1 there has to be sensible, theoretical practice.

Hi. I just wanted to know in general how long it would take for one to play chopin etudes and concertos. Anyway's I'm not attempting them to play that as of now as I know I cannot play even a single bar. Lol

Fur Elise on the whole is considered a Grade 4 piece. My advise would be this, if you do not want to go down the piano teacher route whether it's financial reasons or simply your level of interest, then go onto the Royal School of Music website and check their syllabus, they advise what an exam would consist of and the accepted pieces to play. Go to grade 1, and work from there, find the pieces, learn some scales get a real understanding for the piano.

Thanks for the website. I'll look into it and see their curriculum. I do have a thorough understanding of chords because I play the guitar and have been playing it for about 10 years now. But yeah, as you have suggested I'll need some time to get to know the notes on the keys for chord construction and stuff. I'll work on that as well. I have purchased this series called "Learn and Master Piano" and I'm immensely enjoying it.
 

The Etudes can become part of a bigger goal so when it comes to actually learning the songs you're not just reading notes and pressing keys, you're getting a true feel for the music. If you don't believe you can have that passion, then I would say learning the piano isn't for you.

Well said. I do remember those days when I struggled to play Metallica and Iron Maiden solos and their riffs. Pretty hard. I was just focusing on getting it right without even getting the feel of it. Only after I have mastered them, I could actually enjoy playing it with a band. I just wish I can feel the stuffs I play on the piano as well.

I 100% support anybody that decides to pick up an instrument and believe anything can be achieved with a sensible approach.

Thanks a lot for your support.

[bala12345]

And of course it would be wonderful if anything was possible but I just know it isn't. And I was talking stricly about an ADULT beginner, of course every pianist has been a beginner at some point. But it's just very different when you start as a child. An adult has a different mentality, a lot of baggage and LIFE tends to get in the way. Also this level of piano music does require some physical and mental aptitude that many people simply do not possess.

Yeah. Totally agree. Really sad that I'm an adult already and I go work for 10 hours a day. I did pick up the guitar during my school days and I had a lot of time playing my guitar. I really wished I had so much time now to start playing the piano. I was more into heavy metal during my college days and I discovered classical music at 25 I wished I picked up the piano too when I was a child.

To be able to play these 2 sets of etudes to a reasonable standard isn't just about keeping at it for a certain number of hours or years or moving up grade by grade. If it was so, there would be a lot of amateur pianists who can manage them. Yet there are only a handful and EVERYONE I have encountered has studied piano since childhood. or early teens. Feel free to prove my estimated 99,9% wrong by examples

Cool. Lets see where the journey goes and lets see someday in the future if I can master them Thank you for being realistic. Its just the more time we invest the more we accomplish. But the sad part is the we have no time when we are adults

[louispodesta]

Once again, a lot of well intentioned responders wasting their sincere efforts on someone who is not, and never will be serious as a pianist.  Am I the only who picks up on this fraud?

The original post was ludicrous!

[dogperson]

Once again, a lot of well intentioned responders wasting their sincere efforts on someone who is not, and never will be serious as a pianist.  Am I the only who picks up on this fraud?

The original post was ludicrous!

Really?  Don't you remember loving music, and just starting to play the piano?  As a very young beginner I remember wondering how soon I could play Chopin's 'Fantasie Impromptu' because I loved it so much.  I just had no one to ask   Your conclusion is both unwarranted and the type of post that is thoroughly discouraging to adult beginner. There was nothing in the original post that indicated the OP was anything more than curious. 

[louispodesta]

I was "forced" to take piano lessons as a young child, and I hated it.

Accordingly, in a prior post, on another website (Teachers Forum), I stated that 90% percent of those who matriculated at the piano (at this age) quit after two to three years.  The only teacher who challenged me on this statistic stated that !00% of her students had done the same during the same time frame.

[dogperson]

I was "forced" to take piano lessons as a young child, and I hated it.

Accordingly, in a prior post, on another website (Teachers Forum), I stated that 90% percent of those who matriculated at the piano (at this age) quit after two to three years.  The only teacher who challenged me on this statistic stated that !00% of her students had done the same during the same time frame.

So what if 90% quit? Read the entirety of the comments by the OP. Initial question of curiosity, and subsequent posts show that greater than 5 years to learn is ok because he/she is exited about music and the journey of learning.  This should meet your definition of serious.. a love of music and accepting that it won't be quick and easy to learn the piano. If  it doesn't meet your criteria for 'serious'  it seemed to for everyone else, otherwise they would not have replied in a helpful way.  It is no one's place to make this unwarranted assumption about another person and what will happen in the long-run  when there is every indication of a love of music and the desire to learn. 

[bala12345]

Once again, a lot of well intentioned responders wasting their sincere efforts on someone who is not, and never will be serious as a pianist.  Am I the only who picks up on this fraud?

The original post was ludicrous!

Lol. How do you know whether I'll continue or whether I'll quit? Fraud? The term used doesn't even make any sense. If you go through the full post you will know that I'm a guitar player too. Let me tell u something. I played the guitar for four years and I could play any of iron maiden and Metallica solos. That is because of my dedication and love for the music. Im not boasting but starting upright facts. Since I don't know how long it would take to play Beethoven concertos on piano I wanted to ask the same to people who have accomplished the same, so that I'll have a fair idea about how long it might take for one to play Beethoven or Chopin. Was that wrong? Stop hating and go back to learning something useful on the piano. Bye

[bala12345]

I was "forced" to take piano lessons as a young child, and I hated it.

Accordingly, in a prior post, on another website (Teachers Forum), I stated that 90% percent of those who matriculated at the piano (at this age) quit after two to three years.  The only teacher who challenged me on this statistic stated that !00% of her students had done the same during the same time frame.

See. Your post says it all. You HATED taking the piano lessons and that's why u wanted to quit. I love playing the piano and that's why I'll continue. Do you see the difference??  Just because 90% leave doesn't mean I am one among them. Lol. Statistics just generalizes stuffs. It's just you're love for the music and love for playing the piano that makes an impact.

[louispodesta]

At the soon age of 64, with my current psoriatic arthritis flare-up and my chronic low-level Parkinson's Disease, I have had to and continue to take millions of baby steps at the piano, most of you would not be able to last at a few months.  I put in my two hours in the morning, and then my two hours in the afternoon, all year round!

Picking up guitar, which I always recommend for beginning musicians, is not in the same universe as learning the enormous ins and outs of playing serious classical piano which is what Beethoven Concerti and Chopin Etude playing is.

I mean you guys go from telling one OP in another thread that they are washed-up at the age of 30 because they have not seriously matriculated in Conservatory at the age of 30 to telling this OP:  "whatever man, be cool."   You might want to have it both ways, but you cannot!

[dogperson]

At the soon age of 64, with my current psoriatic arthritis flare-up and my chronic low-level Parkinson's Disease, I have had to and continue to take millions of baby steps at the piano, most of you would not be able to last at a few months.  I put in my two hours in the morning, and then my two hours in the afternoon, all year round!

Picking up guitar, which I always recommend for beginning musicians, is not in the same universe as learning the enormous ins and outs of playing serious classical piano which is what Beethoven Concerti and Chopin Etude playing is.

I mean you guys go from telling one OP in another thread that they are washed-up at the age of 30 because they have not seriously matriculated in Conservatory at the age of 30 to telling this OP:  "whatev


er man, be cool."   You might want to have it both ways, but you cannot!

Here is the bottom line:
This was a a post on the STUDENT forum, From an adult who loves music and wants to play.
If you want to believe adult beginners can't be serious, because they will all quit, then don't read these posts from adult beginners. If you accidentally read them, Forget the negative replies and the gross negative generalizations.

It is hard enough as an adult beginner without these kind of comments.
I think you know the distinction from the other post  but just don't want to acknowledge the meanness of your post.  Enough said.

[dcstudio]

\

It is hard enough as an adult beginner without these kind of comments.

you are correct... adult beginners have a really rough time...  especially those who never studied any instrument.   

some of us cranky old timers get a little miffed when folks come along and declare that they are going learn how to play.   we look back on the years and years of lessons we had---endless hours of locking ourselves away from the world and practicing while our friends went out to party--studying theory, music history, sight-singing, ear training...all of that.   we think of how long it took before we really understood what all that information meant--and how to apply it.  we remember all the disappointing recitals where we failed before we learned how to really play with confidence.   
we understand how incredibly devoted we have been our entire lives and how that devotion shows in our playing, our technique, and our repertoire.  It is truly our life's passion.

then someone comes along with absolutely no idea what is involved in learning how to play the piano and says-- "I'm going to take lessons, and in a year I will be able to play all the Bach Inventions..."

they mean well... and they are just excited because they have discovered that they love music and  that they want to be a part of it--but it's like insulting...kind of.   It's like someone is saying "...ahhhh what you did--it's not so hard--I could do THAT!  all I need to do is take a few lessons.."


it's hard sometimes to hold back the urge to scream at them that they have no Earthly idea  what they are talking about...  lol...     


so don't take it personally...  those of us who have been playing for a lifetime have dealt with people like this a million times...  it's a pre-programmed response...

[mjames]

"I'm going to take lessons, and in a year I will be able to play all the Bach Inventions..."

If you're talking about me then Id like to let you know that I've been playing for a few years...

Besides, the inventions ARE a good goal for a complete beginner. Certainly a much better mindset than someone who thinks they're going to play 24 etudes in 5 years. You're acting as if the inventions are 5 part fugues or something, they're not. They were written for beginners to counterpoint music. I mean, you do have to start somewhere. 

[dcstudio]

If you're talking about me then Id like to let you know that I've been playing for a few years...

Besides, the inventions ARE a good goal for a complete beginner.

I know you're not a beginner mjames...


I wasn't  talking about you--just using that post as an example.  The inventions are a good goal, sure... I have never seen a student learn them all in a year...but it's very possible.  I never had a student who wanted to learn all the inventions...that would be quite amazing in and of itself... I was just trying to explain why sometimes the adult student doesn't get a lot of support from serious piano teachers.

Most of the adults who take up the piano with no previous training either have wanted to do it their whole lives--in which case they often have these preconceived fantasy ideas of what it means to be a "pianist"--or they are having some kind of mid-life crisis and suddenly for some reason feel the urge to  play an instrument....these are usually the ones who think a year of piano lessons and they should "get it"...they often ask how long will it take until I can play this or that....  not all adults, of course---but more often then not they can be put into one of these categories.

I speak from the experience of 20 years of teaching--that's why I am cranky...sorry.

...  I have one really odd adult success story that is the exception to this, though.  A 72 yr old lady who had never had any musical training or experience of any kind---she was quite terrible at first.   I taught her how to read chord charts and lead sheets in addition to the standard adult beginner stuff.   It took 3 years before she really started to play music but she did it.   She played at the recitals with all the kids and loved it.   She was very determined-- far more so than she was talented--she is one of my all time favorite students.. great lady.  Never once asked "how long until I can play ____?"

[outin]

Most of the adults who take up the piano with no previous training either have wanted to do it their whole lives--in which case they often have these preconceived fantasy ideas of what it means to be a "pianist"--or they are having some kind of mid-life crisis and suddenly for some reason feel the urge to  play an instrument....these are usually the ones who think a year of piano lessons and they should "get it"...they often ask how long will it take until I can play this or that....  not all adults, of course---but more often then not they can be put into one of these categories.

I feel kind of lucky now that it was just a sudden whim for me, no planning and I didn't even think about pianos those past decades. So I had very little emotionally invested in the beginning (of course I did still ask those same silly questions at some point

Now that I HAVE a lot of sweat and tears invested already, quitting doesn't even seem like an option anymore despite the fact it turned out to be almost impossible to tame that beast...

[dcstudio]

 quitting doesn't even seem like an option anymore despite the fact it turned out to be almost impossible to tame that beast...

 great attitude...   

that's the secret... really... it's impossible.   I have never met a pianist who was truly "cool" with his own abilities... we are all of us, no matter how long we've been doing this...still learning...  and never for a moment satisfied that we are the best we can be... 

I remember watching my teacher play when I was young---and imagining what it must feel like to be able to do that.  What it's like to walk around the planet and have hands that can do that...wow...  If I could play like that I would be so happy---it would be so awesome...my friends would be sooooo amazed---- If I could do that--I could do anything...I was sure of it...lol.

it never really happens though...  you play longer and longer and you get better and better--but there's always another hurdle ahead...always more to do. 

In the beginning you need that fantasy though--if people had any idea of how the piano was going to rule their entire life--they would surely pass it by...

[louispodesta]

great attitude...   

that's the secret... really... it's impossible.   I have never met a pianist who was truly "cool" with his own abilities... we are all of us, no matter how long we've been doing this...still learning...  and never for a moment satisfied that we are the best we can be... 

I remember watching my teacher play when I was young---and imagining what it must feel like to be able to do that.  What it's like to walk around the planet and have hands that can do that...wow...  If I could play like that I would be so happy---it would be so awesome...my friends would be sooooo amazed---- If I could do that--I could do anything...I was sure of it...lol.

it never really happens though...  you play longer and longer and you get better and better--but there's always another hurdle ahead...always more to do. 

In the beginning you need that fantasy though--if people had any idea of how the piano was going to rule their entire life--they would surely pass it by...

Thanks for all of your very insightful comments.  Your years of teaching experience shine through.

However, what has been lost here, in my opinion, is that the OP didn't inquire about learning how to play the piano, in general.  What was proffered was a very specific inquiry regarding how long it would take to learn the Beethoven 4 and 5, and also the Chopin Etudes.

These pieces are at the top of the concert piano food chain and take years and years to master.  The inference that it is even remotely possible to get to this point, through some magical formula, is pure folly and you folks know it.

And, it is no way comparable to learning how to play the guitar.

[dcstudio]

Thanks for all of your very insightful comments.  Your years of teaching experience shine through.

However, what has been lost here, in my opinion, is that the OP didn't inquire about learning how to play the piano, in general.  What was proffered was a very specific inquiry regarding how long it would take to learn the Beethoven 4 and 5, and also the Chopin Etudes.

These pieces are at the top of the concert piano food chain and take years and years to master.  The inference that it is even remotely possible to get to this point, through some magical formula, is pure folly and you folks know it.

And, it is no way comparable to learning how to play the guitar.

ohhhhh you are preachin to the choir my friend... these are my sentiments, exactly... but if they are willing to pay for lessons... I let them think what they want in that regard...
 I play guitar, too...sometimes I even get paid.   it's way way easier...especially if you are on the non-classical route. My husband is a jazz guitarist...we have been having this argument for 20 years...

  --this is me playing the guitar... if you're interested.


     I figure that even if the OP is just trolling...not everyone who reads this string is.
judging by your tone...you seem to find it rather insulting, too....lol


I also love it when people tell me they could've played like me--but_________... you can not begin to fathom the range of excuses I have heard...everything imaginable except---"I just didn't invest the time...  I didn't practice"

another great one is---
"my second-cousin Billy-Joe Jim Bob---he can play just like you and he's only 12--he can play Mozart even!"

even if Billy-Joe is the most talented 12 year old on the planet---I have something he doesn't have and can't have---46 years of experience...lol

after a while you figure it out---non-musicians are absolutely clueless---they have no ability or desire really to understand what you do...  they can't even tell if the instrument is out of tune most of the time.

every now and then a non-musician has a mid-life crisis and decides that it's possible for them at 35 years old to become the next Van Cliburn... they usually become obsessed with learning one singular piece--like "the entertainer"  or for real dreamers--Liszt HR2--lol...  the fantasy usually runs it's course in a few months or a year at most...then they quit sometimes angrily... sometimes completely defeated...

they all seem to think there is some secret that I know that I can just tell them--and then they will be able to play...    like I said...clueless

[pencilart3]

Hi. Extreme beginner here. I just had a session of just one hour on my new piano. So I just played two hours up to now my entire life on piano. Lol. I'm just wondering how long it might take for one to play Beethoven 4th or 5th piano concerto completely? Also how long it would take for one to play Chopin etudes? If any of you guys have mastered these stuffs how long did it take you to play the same. (Considering the moment you touched the piano). How many months, years etc? Thanks.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Oh I see, you were being serious, my bad.

I started when I was 5, I'm 15 now and I'm playing Chopin 10/5 and 25/6. But 25/6 isn't up to speed, of course...

[louispodesta]

ohhhhh you are preachin to the choir my friend... these are my sentiments, exactly... but if they are willing to pay for lessons... I let them think what they want in that regard...
 I play guitar, too...sometimes I even get paid.   it's way way easier...especially if you are on the non-classical route. My husband is a jazz guitarist...we have been having this argument for 20 years...

  --this is me playing the guitar... if you're interested.


     I figure that even if the OP is just trolling...not everyone who reads this string is.
judging by your tone...you seem to find it rather insulting, too....lol


I also love it when people tell me they could've played like me--but_________... you can not begin to fathom the range of excuses I have heard...everything imaginable except---"I just didn't invest the time...  I didn't practice"

another great one is---
"my second-cousin Billy-Joe Jim Bob---he can play just like you and he's only 12--he can play Mozart even!"

even if Billy-Joe is the most talented 12 year old on the planet---I have something he doesn't have and can't have---46 years of experience...lol

after a while you figure it out---non-musicians are absolutely clueless---they have no ability or desire really to understand what you do...  they can't even tell if the instrument is out of tune most of the time.

every now and then a non-musician has a mid-life crisis and decides that it's possible for them at 35 years old to become the next Van Cliburn... they usually become obsessed with learning one singular piece--like "the entertainer"  or for real dreamers--Liszt HR2--lol...  the fantasy usually runs it's course in a few months or a year at most...then they quit sometimes angrily... sometimes completely defeated...

they all seem to think there is some secret that I know that I can just tell them--and then they will be able to play...    like I said...clueless

Thank you so much for your once again, on point, insightful comments.  And, in regards the study of classical guitar (a true Fine Art), I share with you the following comment made by a high school friend - 1969 (originally a sociology major, who now holds a M.M in Guitar from UNT):

"Any idiot can learn how to play rock or folk guitar in three years."

Obviously, in your particular situation you have, as a professional musician (which the OP is not!) taken it to more than the next level.

God bless the piano, and all of the history and respect it deserves.  That is the point!

[dcstudio]

(originally a sociology major, who now holds a M.M in Guitar from UNT):

University of North Texas??   that's where I went to school...   

[outin]

"Any idiot can learn how to play rock or folk guitar in three years."

Much less if you're in a punk band

[emill]

...trust me...you don't want to know.     

If you're average, fairly young and work like a slave, maybe..... 5 years?

x.x.x.x.x.x.x....  it's best that you put in some more approachable goals for now.
Your goal for the year should be: "Learn all of Bach's inventions!" 

I like the practical honesty around here!!!

and by the way ... ambition is good and a must!!  GOOD LUCK and enjoy.
 

[twelfthroot2]

The journey itself is the reward.

I completely agree.  If a person hates practicing and only values playing the pieces in full, then either this person will never become very good or they will not enjoy their life (assuming they practice a lot).

[themusne]

This is an extremely difficult task.I have ever played some Chopin etudes and found that I could not able to finished the whole piece no matter how hard I try. Then I played it in slow tempo. So I think I must first practicing other technical studies to impove my skill. I hope I will be sucessful as soon as possible. And good luck for you.

[ganymedger]

I started playing piano at the age of 17. Now im 27 and I can play Chopin Etudes Op.10 no.1,2, 12 and Op.25 no.6.

Before starting to learn the piano I played flute, and saxophone and a bit of guitar. My parents put me in the music lessons as I started elementary school. My teacher was the wife of a biology professor at the university. She was a very well-trained musician, who played violin, flute and other instruments. She taught me how to read notes, played a lot of bach with me and taught me much about classical music in general. I still see her every now and then and chit-chat with her .

My parents are unmusical , but we grew up in a very musical environment. My neighbour in the first floor was a very good pianist, who studied piano and compisition , music theory.

Im very grateful to my parents that I had to opportunity to learn so much about music with so many amazing musicians.

 I always had lots of regrets that I started playing piano so late. I would have never imagined 10 years ago that I would be able to play Chopin Etude in thirds with ease.

[roncesvalles]

It will take a very long time.  These were composers who played the piano from a very young age and were among the greatest technicians at their instruments in their respective eras.  Their works explore what is possible on the piano, surpassing much of the two centuries worth of music that preceded them in terms of both difficulty and expression (which is a difficulty in itself).

I'm an adult beginner, as well.  There are things you want to play, but then there are things you should play.  You should get a teacher if you can find the time--it is good to be able to ask questions, to be able to be corrected.  You should also get books to get the proper fingerings of scales, chords, and arpeggios, and play them with both hands until they're as easy as breathing.    You should get books filled with easy works and slowly work your way through them.  Then you should pick up Mozart's works and learn them (and study them, if you also intend to compose).   After familiarizing yourself with Mozart, who exposes you to all kinds of keyboard figurations (in what is now considered to be a limited way, thanks to centuries of advances in keyboard manufacturing and pedagogy), pick up Bach, who often requires your left hand to be as good as your right, and who offers some truly complex music for your mind and fingers.   Then try your hand at some of the intermediate Chopin and Beethoven.  Try to learn Chopin Op. 10 no. 3, and, if you succeed, maybe move on to Op. 10 no. 12.

In order to play the Chopin Etudes you need to have a full grasp of all of the techniques covered by the Etudes.   This takes a long time, especially for an adult beginner.  Think of the Etudes not as much as "studies" but as graduation pieces after years of study, a confirmation of years of hard work and dedication.   It's a good goal to have, but there's so much great music to be found that isn't so demanding.  You should focus on these for the time being, maybe being aware, at a background level, of the skills required of these monuments of piano writing. 

[hfmadopter]

I don't consider myself a great pianist and maybe not the worst either but 5 years to be able to play all the Chopin Etudes ? Are you kidding me ? At about 5 years my teacher ( about 35 years ago now) was giving me snippets of them to aid in technique to use in say Mozart or Beethoven pieces that I actually was leaning to " play". But hey that was me, everything moves faster today.

[kawai_cs]

Think of the Etudes not as much as "studies" but as graduation pieces after years of study, a confirmation of years of hard work and dedication. 

That's very well said and actually exactly how I see those etudes.

But hey that was me, everything moves faster today.

Yeah, nowadays beginners play Chopin etudes (see other threads) and intermediates his ballades. One has to be really careful not to accidentally hit PLAY on youtube and get one's ears bleeding.

[pencilart3]

One has to be really careful not to accidentally hit PLAY on youtube and get one's ears bleeding.

[kawai_cs]

 

Is it from Chopin competition for amateurs in Warsaw? I think I can remember that picture and same bunch of flowers but I might be wrong.
I like to think it was stress caused by performing in Chopin's native country and next to his picture

[kevonthegreatpianist]

Hi. Extreme beginner here. I just had a session of just one hour on my new piano. So I just played two hours up to now my entire life on piano. Lol. I'm just wondering how long it might take for one to play Beethoven 4th or 5th piano concerto completely? Also how long it would take for one to play Chopin etudes? If any of you guys have mastered these stuffs how long did it take you to play the same. (Considering the moment you touched the piano). How many months, years etc? Thanks.

ummmmmmm

probably around a decade

lol

if you played two hours of piano for you whole life, stick to Chopsticks. its not recommended to even play chopin or beethoven

[pencilart3]

I like to think it was stress caused by performing in Chopin's native country and next to his picture

Performing? Don't you mean butchering?

[mjames]

so OP, how is it going? Still think you can play the op. 10 and op. 25 etudes in 5 years?

[josh93248]

so OP, how is it going? Still think you can play the op. 10 and op. 25 etudes in 5 years?

Looks like he's gone, from Pianostreet if not the keyboard. Oh well, at least this thread revealed some of the interesting attitudes of the forum members.

BTW, I plan on starting the Chopin Etudes in several months, not all at once of course, and over the span of several years after that too... I started about 5 years ago... Funny, no?

[outin]

Looks like he's gone, from Pianostreet if not the keyboard. Oh well, at least this thread revealed some of the interesting attitudes of the forum members.

BTW, I plan on starting the Chopin Etudes in several months, not all at once of course, and over the span of several years after that too... I started about 5 years ago... Funny, no?

I sincerely hope you will be in the 0,1% mentioned in my post above:)