Dmitri Shostakovich - 24 Preludes & Fugues for Piano Op.87 (Keith Jarrett)

[presto agitato]

Hello,

In my opinion this is the finest recording of these preludes and fugues.

I have listened to Nikolayeva's recording and Ashkenazy's recording as well.  I do believe that Jarrettīs approach is the most convincing one. He seems to understand these pieces so deeply yet so simply.

Keith Jarrett is by far one of the best pianists in the history of mankind. His imagination and versatility are unmatched. The recording was made in 1991 in Switzerland. The sound quality is amazing.  
What do you think?

[outin]

I think it's quite an achievement for a jazz pianist to record these convincenly...but would I listen to him rather than the two you mentioned? I don't think so.

So have you listened to Melnikov's?

[mjames]

I think it's quite an achievement for a jazz pianist to record these convincenly...

Why? You do know that a large pool of Jazz musicians are classically trained, right? Why is it that a lot of classical musicians put off a sort of air of superiority around Jazz musicians? Quite insulting.

At least Jazz musicians can write their own music.  

[outin]

Why? You do know that a large pool of Jazz musicians are classically trained, right? Why is it that a lot of classical musicians put off a sort of air of superiority around Jazz musicians? Quite insulting.

At least Jazz musicians can write their own music.  

You were reading something into my post that wasn't there.

I love jazz, I used to sing with a jazz ensemble and I have utmost respect for jazz musicians.

But it's another language and to get so good at that and ALSO be able to get good enough on the classical genre to record this set in a professional manner is a rare achievement. Very few people with "classical training" behind them who are not playing such music for living and studying it full time would be able to do that.

[mjames]

You were reading something into my post that wasn't there.

I love jazz, I used to sing with a jazz ensemble and I have utmost respect for jazz musicians.

But it's another language and to get so good at that and ALSO be able to get good enough on the classical genre to record this set in a professional manner is a rare achievement. Very few people with "classical training" behind them who are not playing such music for living and studying it full time would be able to do that.

I am by no means a fan, but Keith Jarret has been performing classical music in public long before he started playing Jazz. He was a child prodigy. >_>

[outin]

I am by no means a fan, but Keith Jarret has been performing classical music in public long before he started playing Jazz. He was a child prodigy. >_>

Yes, but don't you agree that both jazz and classical is a life-long study and at some point most people have to make a choice. I know pianists who are good at both but that's not the same as being on the level of the greatest.

I happen to be a great fan of Shosty and think this set is worthy of the highest level of pianism usually only possible for full time classical performers. If you know many jazz pianists that can pull off what Jarret can, I'll be happy to know about them.

[mjames]

Yes, but don't you agree that both jazz and classical is a life-long study and at some point most people have to make a choice. I know pianists who are good at both but that's not the same as being on the level of the greatest.

No i don't think you have to make a choice. Besides, this whole "classical music language" is a ridiculous umbrella term. There's no one language for classical music. If we expect classical musicians to be able to perform music that's not only centuries apart, but also vastly stylistically different (for example scarlatti and Scriabin) why is it suddenly such an "OH MY GOD" when a classically trained Jazz pianist plays Chopin or Mozart?

No I don't agree with these ridiculous mental barriers people like to put in music. Most Jazz and classical pianists don't perform both in public like Keith because many ultimately view them as "different worlds." However, I don't believe its necessary for one to choose between either one or the other in order to become great at either one of them.

[outin]

No i don't think you have to make a choice. Besides, this whole "classical music language" is a ridiculous umbrella term. There's no one language for classical music. If we expect classical musicians to be able to perform music that's not only centuries apart, but also vastly stylistically different (for example scarlatti and Scriabin) why is it suddenly such an "OH MY GOD" when a classically trained Jazz pianist plays Chopin or Mozart?

No I don't agree with these ridiculous mental barriers people like to put in music. Most Jazz and classical pianists don't perform both in public like Keith because many ultimately view them as "different worlds." However, I don't believe its necessary for one to choose between either one or the other in order to become great at either one of them.

Well, feel free to disagree. But again you are imagining my "mental barriers", I am just observing things how they are. You are yet to name all those jazz pianists who can readily cross over to the SAME level of mastery in classical music (or the other way round).

I never said jazz pianists could not perform classical pieces well. Of course they can. Did you even read what I wrote? Even few classical pianists can perform the P&F on the level of VA or TN. And that was what was discussed here. I get it that you have issues with people's prejudices, but no need to take it on me.

BTW. A world class classical pianist is expected to be familiar with all those eras of music you mention and I believe building on that is partly what makes it possible for them to perform works as the one mentioned here so exceptionally well. It's not only about being able to play the pieces technically, it's about understanding the music, the references in it and how it builds on tradition...

[mjames]

Well, feel free to disagree. But again you are imagining my "mental barriers", I am just observing things how they are. You are yet to name all those jazz pianists who can readily cross over to the SAME level of mastery in classical music (or the other way round).

I don't listen to jazz.

I never said jazz pianists could not perform classical pieces well. Of course they can. Did you even read what I wrote?

I never claimed you did. What I was asserting was that one doesn't have to choose one or the other to achieve mastery at either one of them. It seems to me like you're the one who has issues with reading comprehension.

It's like you can't type anything without coming off as a condescending jerk.

It's not only about being able to play the pieces technically, it's about understanding the music, the references in it and how it builds on tradition...

Which is something basically anyone can do, especially a jazz pianist.

Take this as the last post I'm ever going to write to you. I honestly don't have time to talk to condescending arseholes who make assumptions about my "issues."

Fck off.

[adodd81802]

Surely this kind of language cannot be acceptable. Is there an age limit on users joining up that can view this content?

Moderators - Can we lock this thread before it escalates even more ridiculously on this. What an absolute joke.

[adodd81802]

Why? You do know that a large pool of Jazz musicians are classically trained, right? Why is it that a lot of classical musicians put off a sort of air of superiority around Jazz musicians? Quite insulting.

At least Jazz musicians can write their own music.  

I have found your posts in other forums often being quickly defensive almost in an aggressive way attacking others' opinions. You don't have to agree, but this back and forth does nothing to assist with the OP, I strongly suggest you concentrate on answering the questions rather than slandering other users.

[mjames]

I have found your posts in other forums often being quickly defensive almost in an aggressive way attacking others' opinions. You don't have to agree, but this back and forth does nothing to assist with the OP, I strongly suggest you concentrate on answering the questions rather than slandering other users.

Take a look at the opening post once again, he wasn't asking for assistance.

Besides, I made a comment on someone else's post, that's what forums are for: discussion. You don't have to agree with the way I do things, so you can either continue to enforce your high-force persona or you can shove it up your arse and ignore me. That's what I do to users I dislike.

[outin]

Surely this kind of language cannot be acceptable. Is there an age limit on users joining up that can view this content?

Moderators - Can we lock this thread before it escalates even more ridiculously on this. What an absolute joke.

Surely there's no need to lock the thread over a little disagreement. And the forum software takes care of nasty words... I would still love to see some discussion on the P&F and any other good recordings around.

[adodd81802]

Take a look at the opening post once again, he wasn't asking for assistance.

Besides, I made a comment on someone else's post, that's what forums are for: discussion. You don't have to agree with the way I do things, so you can either continue to enforce your high-force persona or you can shove it up your arse and ignore me. That's what I do to users I dislike.

Who even do you think you are?

That's fine I don't have to waste my time with people like you. I'll be removing my account after this. Thanks for the advice.

[visitor]

i like the video that was posted. i have no idea what this thread is about. here is a rabbit w/ a pancake on its head.

[mjames]

Who even do you think you are?

That's fine I don't have to waste my time with people like you. I'll be removing my account after this. Thanks for the advice.

Hurr duuur

I am me; who else would I be? You were the one who came in here and suggested as to what I should be doing. Your high-horse jibber jabber sure back-fired, didn't it? Good, leave; I don't give a damn.  

I'll go back to doing what I have been doing the whole day: practicing the delicious Chopin nocturnes!

[toughbo]

Since the preludes and fugues are among my favourite compositions I'm reviving this to recommend you all to have a listen to Jenny Lin's rendition.
I'm listening to it for the third time this week and it simply is a delight every time

[visitor]

i'm a big big big of Bill's show, 'exploring  music' it's musicology for the classical masses and history buffs. the show is top shelf on all accounts. here's the intro to his Shosty series (highly recommend to listen to the whole series,)
this introduces the composer and the background that sets the stage for what's to come, eventually of course this work of genius 24 p and fs....
https://blogs.wfmt.com/offmic/2014/02/10/exploring-music-shostakovich/

*link to play intro is at top of page w audio playback bar

[dcstudio]

i like the video that was posted. i have no idea what this thread is about. here is a rabbit w/ a pancake on its head.

you are awesome!! LOL LOL I was gearing up to put in my 2 cents on this and then seriously lost it when I came to your post. 

guess I really have nothing to add to that... Keith Jarret is one of the most amazing pianists on the planet no doubt... and everybody here knows how I feel about jazz... 

as for how classical pianists feel about us jazzers...  I have wowed my share of concert pianists who sat at the edge of the piano while I played jazz improv and got the crowd singing along. They have always treated me with the utmost respect and a sort of odd fascination.  I have been half in and out of these two worlds my entire career.   I am equally amazed by the many concert pianists I have come in contact with--sometimes I have sat and compared notes with them for hours.  The conversation is always fascinating and really exciting... though our musical focus is a little different...we still have PLENTY IN COMMON...

[visitor]

you are awesome!! LOL LOL I was gearing up to put in my 2 cents on this and then seriously lost it when I came to your post. 

g...

well what can we say. we do aim to please 

[dcstudio]

well what can we say. we do aim to please 

my emotions were totally diffused... thank you very much! lol I would have probably started ranting.

[visitor]

my emotions were totally diffused... thank you very much! lol I would have probably started ranting.

any time. tis' the season for giving. and sharing is caring. 

[dcstudio]

  that's better than the pancake...and who doesn't love bunnies!

Merry Christmas!

[toughbo]

And you guys wonder why people start new threads on the same topics all the time...

[dcstudio]

And you guys wonder why people start new threads on the same topics all the time...

apologies...but this thread went south long before Visitor's bunny pancake.  That actually helped.

[chopinlover01]

Honestly there's no need to censor language. Doing so is censoring free speech.
And honestly mjames is right, albeit a bit dickish. But locking the thread does absolutely nothing except prevent people from actually saying how they feel about another person. Had P3 and I not been able to voice our disagreements at each other, we'd probably both have subconscious resentments towards each other.

[toughbo]

It's not about censoring language, it's about the amount of irrelevant replies and about what people bother responding to. It's getting tiresome...

[chopinlover01]

With all due respect, that's the dynamic of this forum sometimes. If you can't stand it, we aren't exactly forcing you to stay.

[toughbo]

I suspect only a select few are interested in this dynamic you are speaking of.