Proper technique for quick fire repeated notes with 4 3 2 fingering?

[boxjuice]

Hi,

I've been having problems with when you play the same note over and over in rapid succession (think HR2 Friska beginning), but instead of hitting the notes with a single finger, you use multiple different fingers (like the beginning of this

). When i try it, it comes out a single sustained note, rather than a repeated note.

Thanks

[louispodesta]

Hi,

I've been having problems with when you play the same note over and over in rapid succession (think HR2 Friska beginning), but instead of hitting the notes with a single finger, you use multiple different fingers (like the beginning of this

). When i try it, it comes out a single sustained note, rather than a repeated note.

Thanks

Everything I hear by Cziffra playing Liszt is saying:  Hey, the devil with the music, I am going to play it faster than anyone else.  And, he does.  However, his Gnomenreigen is awful because it is so fast there is no musicality whatsoever.  Accordingly, his recording of this piece is just the same.

Conversely, when one hears another great Liszt player's recording of the "Grand galop," the repeated notes are not a problem.  That is due to the fact that this a true "Galop," as opposed to Cziffra's off to the races.

Enjoy.

P.S.  In case you think methamphetamines were invented yesterday:  Why do think these great Russians play like lightening in contest, and then later on in recital it is not the same speed level at all.  Oh, I am sorry, I just had this temporary delusion that Russians dope their athletes.

[ronde_des_sylphes]

You are likely to find that the action of individual pianos can affect the ability to play repeated notes. For example, it is usually much easier to play fast repeated notes on a concert grand than an upright. Ultimately it is also about articulation: if you make an analogy to a 1234 scalic passage, then the scale obviously sounds cleaner if the notes are articulated separately and not blurred into each other. With repeated notes, you are just doing the same thing, but on the same note. So if a finger comes down before the preceding finger has been released you will end up with only one strike where there should be two. Sometimes you may find that positioning the wrist at somewhat of an angle to the keyboard may  facilitate the articulation eg William Tell overture.

[dogperson]

A couple of suggestions?
- I agree that the blurring is a lack of individual note articulation.  Josh Wright recommends to think of the location of where you play the note as if there is a small circular piece of paper on the key where the first note is played, and to play successive notes in the exact same location.  He uses the analogy of those small circular remains when you use a hole punch.  You might try that as a means of making sure that no note is held when the next is played.
- Is there any reason you are using 2-3-4-?  You might want to try 1-2-3 and see if you get the clarity you want

[pianoplunker]

P.S.  In case you think methamphetamines were invented yesterday:  Why do think these great Russians play like lightening in contest, and then later on in recital it is not the same speed level at all.  Oh, I am sorry, I just had this temporary delusion that Russians dope their athletes.

Methamphetimines  ruin your rhythm almost instantly. Is it possible the Russians are just fast for a contest and then relaxed at a recital ? No doping ?

[louispodesta]

Methamphetimines  ruin your rhythm almost instantly. Is it possible the Russians are just fast for a contest and then relaxed at a recital ? No doping ?

1)  You obviously do not read the NY Times, as in the breaking news story on Russian doping.

2)  As referenced in a prior post, playing any technically fast passage on an Upright piano is not a true representation of how it would sound on any "properly regulated," (regardless of size) grand piano.

2)  When you take your foot off of the pedal (duh!), there is no blurring.  As an example, I will list a link to one of the most famous films of a live performance of the Gnomenreigen:

He ain't pedaling!  And, he studied this piece under Martin Krause who was a student of the Composer.

[lostinidlewonder]

I've been having problems with when you play the same note over and over in rapid succession .... When i try it, it comes out a single sustained note, rather than a repeated note.

You are probably pushing down on the key for too long, your fingers need to withdraw from the note rapidly. Some pianos unfortunately have terrible action and the keys don't come back up very effectively (or sometimes the key has to come up quite an extra distance and you can't play the note again while it is half depressed to cause the hammers to react)  once released making repeated notes very difficult.