(Sad Time) Grad School Rejection

[xdjuicebox]

I have no idea why I'm posting about this here, but here we go! Maybe it'll make me feel better or something? Who knows.

A bit of background - I quit my job last year to pursue a full-on academic career (I was honestly already sick of the business world about a year into it, but I thought I would try it to be doubly sure I wanted to be in academia); at that point, I hadn't decided between mathematics and composition. I ended up applying to a few schools of both.

So today I received my final rejection from all of the top tier schools that I wanted to go to. I got into a few programs kind of the in the middle tier, but I didn't get in anywhere that I really wanted to go. Which is fine, it was kind of expected actually; I had a mediocre high school transcript, and so I did my undergrad at an okay school. And even though I got perfect grades there, there's someone who got perfect grades at an Ivy League whom the spot is probably much better suited for or something. Maybe they didn't like my research. Maybe I said something on my personal statement that really turned them off. Or maybe they were just having a bad day when they happened to glance at my application. Who knows?

But who cares, what's done is done. I can't change what happened. But I'm still sad about it though.

But the good part for me is that sad time = productive practice, so I'm going to be real productive piano-wise this week while I cope with the painful reality - that sometimes, no matter how hard you try, you still can't do it. Some mistakes you make earlier on you just can't fix, and that follows you around.

But that doesn't mean I shouldn't try anyway, right? I guess I gave it my all, and that's all I could really ask of myself.

If you guys want to help me feel better, that would be well appreciated. Thanks ^^

[mjames]

You can still do interesting research in middle tier schools, man! It doesn't have to be Ivy league. Some of the most interesting results in physics in the past decade were published by academics from schools like University of Texas, Chicago etc. Don't let being "non-Ivy League" define and consequently depress you, you can still be a top tier researcher REGARDLESS of the school. And think about it, if you end up doing some really interesting stuff during your masters or PhD you might have the chance to end up in an Ivy league school for a post-doc or maybe even a tenure position! Artur Avilla, a fields medalist, didn't even graduate from a school that's in the top 100! Seriously, it's not the end yet.

Make the best of what you got man!

[rachmaninoff_forever]

Ivy is overrated anyways

[xdjuicebox]

Thanks guys! I do feel better actually. I'm glad I posted.

Freaking UCLA LOL

[emill]

hi xdjuicebox,

Your desire for further studies into math/music despite the "rejection" from the schools you wanted to pursue those .... is in fact inspiring to our situation.  As a non-pianist parent and Asian at that where we continue to look after the well-being of our children even into their adult lives, I feel uncomfortable that my son continues to pursue purely music studies even in graduate school. I worry a lot about his "future" since there are not as many breaks for musicians, even talented ones, when it comes to "making some money". 

And here you are, and many others, some of whom I know personally, giving up potential lucrative career pathways to pursue their hearts desire despite the not so rosy picture for the future if compared to what they are doing at present.  I personally know 2 doctors who gave up their careers - one a physicist earning very well in NASA and the other a medical doctor, both below 50 to pursue their music dreams.  There must really be something which my conservative and traditional upbringing is obviously missing.

You may find it surprising or strange but your story to me is inspiring.  May I wish you Godspeed.

[fftransform]

University of Texas, Chicago etc.

lol 'merely' UT and U Chicago, only some of the best math programs in the nation.  Sort of like 'merely' Stanford of Berkeley.


OP, what was your math GRE?  I got 880 with 3.96 undergrad GPA, 3.95 MS GPA from a decent school and 'only' got into UT/UW/Ohio State (went with UW) after doing both degrees in 3.5 yrs; I had two theses (a third in philosophy), a perfect regular GRE across the board, and probably a much stronger letter than most.  No REU's but some talks, scholarships and awards, and some leadership roles in student orgs; didn't even know what an REU was until I was applying to schools.  I also was on our Putnam team - though I suck at those things.  To get into Harvard, Princeton (or Stanford, Berkeley, Chicago, Michigan, etc.) you pretty much need to be a Putnam finalist and/or have an undergrad research adviser with pull at your target school.  Otherwise you can apply to all top 10's and still almost definitely not get an acceptance.  Maybe your expectations were unrealistic.  Even with those stats I also got rejected from a couple safety schools, like Iowa and Colorado - Boulder.

You will HAVE to do a post-doc in math, nowadays, often two, unless you just want to teach at the liberal arts level.  Getting post-doc positions at top schools is much easier than getting into their Ph.D. programs . . . assuming your research is up to snuff and you make good connections while in school.

What schools have you heard back positively from, so far?  Also, if any of the schools you really want to get into are still deliberating, it can often help to just e-mail the head of the graduate committee how earnest you are, how it's your favorite school ever, top pick etc.  Worked for me with UW.  Didn't wanna live in Texas or Ohio haha, wanted that legal weed

[xdjuicebox]

lol 'merely' UT and U Chicago, only some of the best math programs in the nation.  Sort of like 'merely' Stanford of Berkeley.


OP, what was your math GRE?  I got 880 with 3.96 undergrad GPA, 3.95 MS GPA from a decent school and 'only' got into UT/UW/Ohio State (went with UW) after doing both degrees in 3.5 yrs; I had two theses (a third in philosophy), a perfect regular GRE across the board, and probably a much stronger letter than most.  No REU's but some talks, scholarships and awards, and some leadership roles in student orgs; didn't even know what an REU was until I was applying to schools.  I also was on our Putnam team - though I suck at those things.  To get into Harvard, Princeton (or Stanford, Berkeley, Chicago, Michigan, etc.) you pretty much need to be a Putnam finalist and/or have an undergrad research adviser with pull at your target school.  Otherwise you can apply to all top 10's and still almost definitely not get an acceptance.  Maybe your expectations were unrealistic.  Even with those stats I also got rejected from a couple safety schools, like Iowa and Colorado - Boulder.

You will HAVE to do a post-doc in math, nowadays, often two, unless you just want to teach at the liberal arts level.  Getting post-doc positions at top schools is much easier than getting into their Ph.D. programs . . . assuming your research is up to snuff and you make good connections while in school.

What schools have you heard back positively from, so far?  Also, if any of the schools you really want to get into are still deliberating, it can often help to just e-mail the head of the graduate committee how earnest you are, how it's your favorite school ever, top pick etc.  Worked for me with UW.  Didn't wanna live in Texas or Ohio haha, wanted that legal weed

UW?!!?! Dang, that's a great place to be!

Haha my math GRE is garbage compared to yours, but my GPA was 3.9ish as well. I didn't do a masters, I went straight for the Ph.D. programs. (After about 2 years of full time work and getting sick of full time work) I was also on my school's Putnam team, and got a decent score in 2014, so that was cool. No REU's unfortunately as well, but a few scholarships. My GRE wasn't perfect, but I 95 percentiled both sections. My reach schools were UCLA/UCSD, but they didn't let me in. I did, however, get into UC Davis for Combinatorics, and I'm going to go there! I didn't apply to any top 10's, I didn't think it would be worth the money haha. I think I'm quite lucky actually, since they're very strong in what I want to do; I met a few professors at JMM earlier this year, and I'm pretty excited. Just needed to get over the initial shock because rejections of any sort hurt. Would've loved UCSD for combinatorics though.

Thanks for the great advice! I have some grand schemes in terms of what I want to do for reserach (and a good chunk of it is chess related )

This might actually be a blessing as well because Kurt Rohde is on the composition faculty at Davis, and I might seek him out for lessons lol

hi xdjuicebox,

Your desire for further studies into math/music despite the "rejection" from the schools you wanted to pursue those .... is in fact inspiring to our situation.  As a non-pianist parent and Asian at that where we continue to look after the well-being of our children even into their adult lives, I feel uncomfortable that my son continues to pursue purely music studies even in graduate school. I worry a lot about his "future" since there are not as many breaks for musicians, even talented ones, when it comes to "making some money". 

And here you are, and many others, some of whom I know personally, giving up potential lucrative career pathways to pursue their hearts desire despite the not so rosy picture for the future if compared to what they are doing at present.  I personally know 2 doctors who gave up their careers - one a physicist earning very well in NASA and the other a medical doctor, both below 50 to pursue their music dreams.  There must really be something which my conservative and traditional upbringing is obviously missing.

You may find it surprising or strange but your story to me is inspiring.  May I wish you Godspeed.

Thank you for your kind words!

I am also of Asian descent, I'm a first-generation immigrant, and my parents came here and worked really hard so that I could go to college here. Literally, we're living the American dream. I talked to my parents about this stuff, and while I don't know what the future holds, I've found that all I really have to do is work my absolute hardest, and things should be fine in the end.

So far, that seems to be working for me, so I see no reason to stop XD

[fftransform]

I didn't do 2014; I did 2012 and 2013.


Check this prelim btw https://math.washington.edu/sites/math/files/documents/grad/prelim-exam-algebra-2016.pdf


Like WTFFFFF  The average score was less than 1 haha

[mjames]

lol 'merely' UT and U Chicago, only some of the best math programs in the nation.  Sort of like 'merely' Stanford of Berkeley.


OP, what was your math GRE?  I got 880 with 3.96 undergrad GPA, 3.95 MS GPA from a decent school and 'only' got into UT/UW/Ohio State (went with UW) after doing both degrees in 3.5 yrs; I had two theses (a third in philosophy), a perfect regular GRE across the board, and probably a much stronger letter than most.  No REU's but some talks, scholarships and awards, and some leadership roles in student orgs; didn't even know what an REU was until I was applying to schools.  I also was on our Putnam team - though I suck at those things.  To get into Harvard, Princeton (or Stanford, Berkeley, Chicago, Michigan, etc.) you pretty much need to be a Putnam finalist and/or have an undergrad research adviser with pull at your target school.  Otherwise you can apply to all top 10's and still almost definitely not get an acceptance.  Maybe your expectations were unrealistic.  Even with those stats I also got rejected from a couple safety schools, like Iowa and Colorado - Boulder.

You will HAVE to do a post-doc in math, nowadays, often two, unless you just want to teach at the liberal arts level.  Getting post-doc positions at top schools is much easier than getting into their Ph.D. programs . . . assuming your research is up to snuff and you make good connections while in school.

What schools have you heard back positively from, so far?  Also, if any of the schools you really want to get into are still deliberating, it can often help to just e-mail the head of the graduate committee how earnest you are, how it's your favorite school ever, top pick etc.  Worked for me with UW.  Didn't wanna live in Texas or Ohio haha, wanted that legal weed

Sorry if I offended you but UT or Chicago don't really have the best physics programs in the country.

[fftransform]

https://www.usnews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-science-schools/physics-rankings

#7 and #14

[timothy42b]

I recently read a study (and sorry, I can't remember where) that looked at the long term success of students based on their board scores and records relative to their college.

Not surprisingly, the top 10% of entering students anywhere were very successful.

But.  It didn't depend on their absolute scores.

If your boards were, say, a 1400 in the old system, you might be a top 10% at one school and a top 50% at a fancy ivy league school. 

Surprise.  That ivy league school wouldn't prepare you for long term success like the school where you were a top 10%.  You'd be down with the other 50%, muddling through, even though your scores were the same