How to play these big Ravel chords comfortably?

[douweziel]

Hey guys!

In the first of Ravel's Valses Nobles et Sentimentales, you have these huge 4 and 5 finger chords and I noticed I simply can't play them without stretching quite a lot. Is there any way to make these chords more comfortable? Leave out some of the middle notes and rely on character and overtones maybe? Do people roll/arpeggiate those? The stretchiness really hinders putting enough forearm support behind the chords and just feels bad and piano playing shouldn't feel bad (Taubman, anyone?)

[lelle]

I think for the character of this piece it's important not to roll these chords. Therefore, I would leave notes out if you can't safely reach these chords. After all, it's the character that matters, not that you leave out a note or two out of necessity.

[mad_max2024]

I don't really know the piece but from the posted pic I would agree. It feels like the chords are meant to be played as a block for a sharp strong sound. Arpeggiating would weaken that and change the effect.

My first instinct would be to leave out the middle notes, the bottom note of the right hand and top note of the left. They are already repeated in the other hand so shouldn't make a big difference to the harmony (depending on what clefs they are in I guess).

But like I said I don't know the piece, I'm just guessing. Someone that knows it or has played it may have a better perspective.

[bwl_13]

I agree with the sentiment that the character is more important than a few individual notes in a chord. Don't hurt yourself stretching, just don't leave out the 7ths or 9ths.

I'm not super familiar with this piece but those are important intervals from a theoretical perspective. I might be wrong

[comma]

Fortunately, we know how Ravel played his own music - at least some of them. When I studied his Pavane, I was surprised to learn how often he rolled big chords. Listen from 2:05: