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Topic: strategies to this section, Debussy "Parfums"  (Read 963 times)

Offline keypeg

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strategies to this section, Debussy "Parfums"
on: July 05, 2023, 06:20:42 PM
(I also asked this in PW) I'm looking for different ways of possibly doing what's written in this passage ".... La basse appuyée et un peu soutenue"

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8wlnhmj90qh704y/Parfums%20la%20basse%20etc.jpg?dl=0

For the "appuyée" it seems that just playing normally brings out the bass because they are lower notes.  The "soutenue" if it sustains a bit, then the LH bassline notes might blend a bit into each other - or the RH notes might be a little bit almost portato - and in turn this would have to be the interplay between pedal and fingers holding down notes for how long. Any thoughts?  Are the directions themselves realistic?

Offline lelle

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Re: strategies to this section, Debussy "Parfums"
Reply #1 on: July 10, 2023, 05:35:49 PM
(I also asked this in PW) I'm looking for different ways of possibly doing what's written in this passage ".... La basse appuyée et un peu soutenue"

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8wlnhmj90qh704y/Parfums%20la%20basse%20etc.jpg?dl=0

For the "appuyée" it seems that just playing normally brings out the bass because they are lower notes.  The "soutenue" if it sustains a bit, then the LH bassline notes might blend a bit into each other - or the RH notes might be a little bit almost portato - and in turn this would have to be the interplay between pedal and fingers holding down notes for how long. Any thoughts?  Are the directions themselves realistic?


My Wiener Urtext has translations for the French instructions and translates the instruction into: "the bass slightly accented and sustained". The way I have always played this is to bring out the bassline slightly and play it with a tight legato, and play the chords portato (staccato under slur is usually portato) and with a softly veiled tonal quality. So basically, as if the base is the melody and the chords are color. Of course, pedal on top of this too, but I do the legato with the fingers.

Offline keypeg

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Re: strategies to this section, Debussy "Parfums"
Reply #2 on: July 12, 2023, 01:58:37 PM
Thank you.  That is what the French says (I read French) - knowing how you do it is helpful.  I imagine the pedal creates the portato so the RH could be playing staccato as long as the pedal "grabs" the notes, while the RH being played legato would naturally be legato.  I like your description of "slightly veiled".

Offline lelle

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Re: strategies to this section, Debussy "Parfums"
Reply #3 on: July 15, 2023, 11:36:02 PM
I would say my staccatos are not very sharp. More like a short "touch" of the keys, on-off, but not actively thinking about making it short and sharp like I would with a real staccato.

Offline keypeg

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Re: strategies to this section, Debussy "Parfums"
Reply #4 on: July 16, 2023, 03:54:45 AM
That makes sense.  Actually I had the understanding that "staccato" came in varying degrees and not necessarily just the short sharp kind.  Or maybe that referred only to the symbol itself (the dot)?

Offline lelle

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Re: strategies to this section, Debussy "Parfums"
Reply #5 on: July 17, 2023, 09:14:22 PM
That makes sense.  Actually I had the understanding that "staccato" came in varying degrees and not necessarily just the short sharp kind.  Or maybe that referred only to the symbol itself (the dot)?

For sure! I just wanted to clarify how I thought about them. If I see staccato I tend to go from sharp and crisp as a starting point, and make it softer if that seems more suitable. But staccato under slur is portato by default.

Offline anacrusis

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Re: strategies to this section, Debussy "Parfums"
Reply #6 on: July 18, 2023, 03:42:14 PM
(I also asked this in PW) I'm looking for different ways of possibly doing what's written in this passage ".... La basse appuyée et un peu soutenue"

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8wlnhmj90qh704y/Parfums%20la%20basse%20etc.jpg?dl=0

For the "appuyée" it seems that just playing normally brings out the bass because they are lower notes.  The "soutenue" if it sustains a bit, then the LH bassline notes might blend a bit into each other - or the RH notes might be a little bit almost portato - and in turn this would have to be the interplay between pedal and fingers holding down notes for how long. Any thoughts?  Are the directions themselves realistic?

Reading your question and the subsequent discussion has me wondering - what makes you feel the directions might not be realistic?

Offline keypeg

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Re: strategies to this section, Debussy "Parfums"
Reply #7 on: July 23, 2023, 08:24:27 PM
Anacrusis - probably poor wording on my part.  It was more along the lines of "how literally might they have been meant".
Since writing my question I've had information from a few sides.  One was that "soutenue" does not literally means "sustained" but rather pervasive, louder, standing out.

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