Top 5 best and hardest Liszt etudes?

[liszt-and-the-galops]

For me...
Hardest (I'm willing to defend this):
1. Mazeppa
2. Feux Follets
3. Chasse-Neige
4. Wilde Jagd
5. Appassionata

Best:
1. Appassionata
2. La Campanella
3. Chasse-Neige
4. Wilde Jagd
5. La Chasse*

*Including 1838, 5. La Campanella (1838)

Hardest, including 1838 versions:
1. Mazeppa (1838)
2. Paganini Etude 4b
3. Wilde Jagd (1838)
4. Feux Follets (1838)
5. Mazeppa (modern version)

[transitional]

Only including the final versions of the Transcendentals and Paganini Etudes.

Hardest:
1. Feux Follets
2. Mazeppa
3. Chasse Neige
4. Appassionata
5. Paganini 6

Best:
1. Ricordanza
2. Chasse-Neige
3. La chasse
4. Harmonies du soir
5. Appassionata

[liszt-and-the-galops]

Only including the final versions of the Transcendentals and Paganini Etudes.

Hardest:
1. Feux Follets
2. Mazeppa
3. Chasse Neige
4. Appassionata
5. Paganini 6

Why no Wilde Jagd? It's at least harder than the Paganini etudes...

[transitional]

Why no Wilde Jagd? It's at least harder than the Paganini etudes...

Of course, I've never tried a piece that difficult, and it's subjective, but Wilde Jagd looks easier than it's made out to be. It seems to be mostly figuring out jumps just for the piece while Paganini Etude 6 is a long-term acquired technique.

I don't think either of us are really experts on the matter, so this is definitely lots of speculation right now.

[liszt-and-the-galops]

Of course, I've never tried a piece that difficult, and it's subjective, but Wilde Jagd looks easier than it's made out to be. It seems to be mostly figuring out jumps just for the piece while Paganini Etude 6 is a long-term acquired technique.

With Wilde Jagd, the massive leaps, rapidly repeated chords, the massive arpeggios, and that one octave trill, all at such a rapid pace, make it ridiculously challenging. On a scale of 1-10 (10 being 9th symphony transcription), I'd give a solid 7-8. The 1838 version especially is absurdly difficult, being on a similar level to the first two movements of Petrushka --Combined.
Paganini 6 has a lot of varied technique, but it's usually at a slower pace. I'd even argue it's easier than La Campanella (which has much more difficult trills and octaves). I think most of us can agree Wilde Jagd is harder than La Campanella.
As for placing it above Appassionata, it's fairly close. No. 10 has many more trills and looks way harder to make the notes sound right, but no. 8's technical difficulty is enough to surpass no. 10 imo.
Surely we can all agree it's easier than Chasse-Neige.

I don't think either of us are really experts on the matter, so this is definitely lots of speculation right now.

Absolutely correct.

[gasplamey]

Best:
1. Preludio
2. La Chasse
3. Appassionata
4. Chasse-Neige
5. Feux Follets

Hardest
1. Feux Follets
2. Mazeppa
3. Chasse-Neige
4. Fusees (Not sure if I spelled that right)
5. Wilde Jagd

Fusees is massively underrated in terms of difficulty.

[liszt-and-the-galops]

Best:
1. Appassionata
2. La Campanella
3. Chasse-Neige
4. Wilde Jagd
5. La Chasse

Best:
1. Ricordanza
2. Chasse-Neige
3. La chasse
4. Harmonies du soir
5. Appassionata

Best:
1. Preludio
2. La Chasse
3. Appassionata
4. Chasse-Neige
5. Feux Follets

It seems that we all agree Chasse-Neige, La Chasse, and Appassionata are among the best lol.

[transitional]

I completely forgot about the Concert Etudes, and might put Un Sospiro higher than Appassionata.

[liszt-and-the-galops]

I completely forgot about the Concert Etudes, and might put Un Sospiro higher than Appassionata.

I'm guessing you mean for favorite?
Also, the other set of Concert Etudes contains Gnomenreigen, which I'd put above La Chasse and 1838 La Campanella for favorite.

[jaquet]

For me...
Hardest (I'm willing to defend this):
1. Mazeppa
2. Feux Follets
3. Chasse-Neige
4. Wilde Jagd
5. Appassionata

  I must ask because ive seen a similar rating many times. Why appasionata easier than wild jagd?
Ive played appasionata and sight read through wild jagd, with appasionata you literally have to learn a new technique, with the overlapping hands in the start and  many other sections (yes i know there are probably many other pieces which use it, but this is the first time i encountered it) with Wild jagd there is nothing revolutionary which i recall, its just a etude-more like a piece though. I can see why you put chasse neige so high but its not that bad. And why Mazeppa over feux follets?

[liszt-and-the-galops]

I can see why you put chasse neige so high but its not that bad. And why Mazeppa over feux follets?

I have essentially never seen a ranking that doesn't put Chasse-Neige as the 3rd hardest, since most people consider it much harder than Wilde Jagd and Appassionata, and also much easier than Mazeppa and Feux Follets.
Mazeppa over Feux Follets is a fairly common ranking (essentially the "Double Thirds vs. Chromatic" of the set), and though I no longer personally would put Mazeppa above Feux Follets, they're still interchangeable.

Why Appassionata easier than Wilde Jagd? I've played Appassionata and sight read through Wilde jagd, with Appassionata you literally have to learn a new technique, with the overlapping hands in the start and  many other sections (yes i know there are probably many other pieces which use it, but this is the first time i encountered it) with Wilde Jagd there is nothing revolutionary which i recall, its just a etude-more like a piece though.

The big problem with Wilde Jagd is how fast it's meant to be played. Sure, it can be done in 5+ minutes, but it's written for only 4.5, which can quickly become a problem when you consider the technique required for it.
Another big factor in my high placement of Wilde Jagd is that I greatly struggle with rapidly repeated Chords (*confused shrug* ), similarly to how you say you struggle with the hand-crossing required for Appassionata.
Point is, it's entirely subjective.

Now the question that I have is how tf gasplamey can put Fusees higher than Wilde Jagd...

[jaquet]

I have essentially never seen a ranking that doesn't put Chasse-Neige as the 3rd hardest, since most people consider it much harder than Wilde Jagd and Appassionata, and also much easier than Mazeppa and Feux Follets.
Mazeppa over Feux Follets is a fairly common ranking (essentially the "Double Thirds vs. Chromatic" of the set), and though I no longer personally would put Mazeppa above Feux Follets, they're still interchangeable.The big problem with Wilde Jagd is how fast it's meant to be played. Sure, it can be done in 5+ minutes, but it's written for only 4.5, which can quickly become a problem when you consider the technique required for it.
Another big factor in my high placement of Wilde Jagd is that I greatly struggle with rapidly repeated Chords (*confused shrug* ), similarly to how you say you struggle with the hand-crossing required for Appassionata.
Point is, it's entirely subjective.

Now the question that I have is how tf gasplamey can put Fusees higher than Wilde Jagd...

Im not sure where youve seen chasse neige be put that high, as ive seen many professional pianists rank it much lower than top 5 actually. I would still put it in top 5 but to be honest there are only few difficult moments. Fusees ive actually seen ranked as 3rd only because mazeppa is longer. The tempo of fusses is literally insane and if requires alot of new techniques(if i remember correctly, i many be completley wrong, but ive just seen ranked among the hardest in the set ) But like you say difficulty is subjective, i remember after i learned this liszt etude i went to tackle a beethoven sonata, op 31 no 1 to be precise, and it was so difficult for me that i had to switch sonatas.(in my experience that is one of the hardest pieces ive tryed playing properly at least- because we have all had cheeky sight reads through gaspard and islamey just for fun so i wont count those) .

[liszt-and-the-galops]

Im not sure where youve seen chasse neige be put that high, as ive seen many professional pianists rank it much lower than top 5 actually. I would still put it in top 5 but to be honest there are only few difficult moments.

Strange. I've seen Chasse-Neige ranked very high quite often; heck, I've even seen some people rank it as the hardest in the set.


Anyways, it's been almost three months since my past rankings, so I'm going to change a few things...
Hardest (excluding 1838):
1. Feux Follets
2. Mazeppa
3. Chasse-Neige
4. Wilde Jagd
5. Appassionata

Best:
1. Appassionata
2. La Chasse
3. S. 140 La Campanella
4. Chasse-Neige
5. S. 140 La Chasse

Hardest (including 1838):
1. S. 140 no. 4b
2. S. 137 Wilde Jagd
3. S. 137 Feux Follets
4. S. 137 Fusees
5. S. 140 no. 4

[cuberdrift]

Hardest (roughly in order but haven't performed them so I can't say for sure):

1. 1838 Paganini 4b
2. 1838 Paganini 6
3. Grand Etude no. 10 (1837)
4. Feux Follets
5. Mazeppa

Best

1. Ricordanza
2. Harmonies du Soir
3. Appassionata
4. Chasse neige
5. Il Lamento