Rachmaninov P.Concerto

[SDL]

I cant stretch the LH very well (only just).  I do the F,C Aflat, the next one Ive tried the CDflat with the index finger crossing both notes (not great), the next and then I cant get the 10ths.  IVe heard this fast spread but I dont like it much.  Anyone got any tips on this opening for my LH.  My RH manages fine on this opening.

Thanks

[fnork]

You could do what Rachmaninov did himself, surprisingly since he had very large hands - play the lowest note (F) seperately before the beat, then on the beat play all of the other notes. Doesn't sound too bad. I mean, you can't help that you have small hands, so if you don't like spreading the chords like arpeggios you can try this instead.

[SDL]

See I don't think my hands are small since I play full 5 note 9th chords with ease and I get round stretchy things like chopin Op10no1.  Not many women have 10th stretches - mines a minor 10th

I did try this bottom note first.  Does Rachmaninov start with the first chord played whole then the rest split like you say?

[fnork]

I think he plays it like you say, I don't really remember.

What do you mean with "stretchy things like op 10no1"? It's NOT a stretching exercise, you're supposed to play the arpeggios WITHOUT stretching and tiring your hand...
obviously, you have a big hand. not big enough for everything rachmaninov wrote, but anyway, if you can't make the first chords then I think you should play the bass note and then the rest of the notes. Or try other things that could work... Ashkenazy does arpeggios, it sounds fine too.

[thierry13]

I have ALL rach's concertos played by himself, and in both versions of the second concerto, he plays the first chord entirely, and then split the bass F with the rest of the LH chord for the rest. And rachmaninoff had ENORMOUS hands. Really, really big hands. So it just sounds better this way, its only how you want to play it. But i'd strongly recommend not to do arpegios for this chords. It sounds really bad and it's really not in the mood of a Rach concerto, even a Rach piece.

[thierry13]

If you want to listen to the latest version, here is the page with the links to download. Watch out, it's russian. But you can follow the links logically. Here it is:
https://classic.manual.ru/Rachmaninov-performer/Rach-2.html

[SDL]

fnork - in the UK we say "stretchy"  meaning something needs an ability to stretch (reach - ie needing a wide hand stretch).  I know Op10.1 isnt a stretching excersise but I manage it but someone with an 8ve reach (stretch)  would probably find this difficult.  Hence - its stretchy.  Just a difference of colloqial language.

[SDL]

Thanks for your replies.  I will do the F like Rachmaninov - if its good enough for him its good enough for me    I do actually prefer this way now.

[fnork]

fnork - in the UK we say "stretchy"  meaning something needs an ability to stretch (reach - ie needing a wide hand stretch).  I know Op10.1 isnt a stretching excersise but I manage it but someone with an 8ve reach (stretch)  would probably find this difficult.  Hence - its stretchy.  Just a difference of colloqial language.

ah, sorry, I misunderstood. luckily, I have big hands too and I've no idea of how it would be like to play op 10.1 with small hands

[thierry13]

I began this etude like 2 days ago and have relatively small hands. I can reach a 10th and it is my big limit. It's not so comfortable but it's ok. The trick in this etude is NOT to stretch, but to do the phrasings by an horizontal move of the wrist. I really don't think having bigger hands would help with this one.

[steinwayguy]

I began this etude like 2 days ago and have relatively small hands. I can reach a 10th and it is my big limit. It's not so comfortable but it's ok. The trick in this etude is NOT to stretch, but to do the phrasings by an horizontal move of the wrist. I really don't think having bigger hands would help with this one.

I think this might be Thierry's first intelligent post.
Having small hands forces you to conciously center your weight on each note, producing a remarkably even tone. I can stretch a 12th, just barely, and one of the biggest problems I had with this etude was producing an even tone, because I always took some form of tone production for granted.

[SDL]

thierry - I wouldnt say you have small hands - its the average.  People with 11 and 12ths have Big hands.  A 9th/10th is all you need to play the piano.  Barenboim had a 9th and ashkenazy a 10th

[thierry13]

Well I don't have small hands, but short finger, I can reach a tenth only because my hand is really really stretched. 1 year ago, a 9th wasn't confortable. Now, a tenth is more comfortable than the 9th was. And my fingers haven't grown. So my hands will probably never be bigger. And I can reach C-E, but not C-E flat. The black keys are too much of a stretch for me. For the left hand it's a little closer, but I touch other notes.

[nikodr]

My hand reaches a 12 c-g but you know since i was a boy i got used to listening the concerto and almost every pianist plays it broken so i am used to it,and while i have the reach i never play the chord in full as written,and thats something you should do,why bother and hurt your hands?

[SDL]

Thanks everyone - this is good news!