Piano Forum Rules

[mikeyg]

Recently, a PF member has complained about his posts being deleted, and said that the rules needed to be much more specific.  I didn't realise what he was talking about until I actually looked at the rules.  Here they are:

To make Piano Forum as useful as possible we ask you to keep to the following regulations:

Please fill out the member profile before using the forum.
Since the main aim of Piano Forum is to provide a service for professional pianists we ask you to try to keep your postings on an, for that purpose, appropriate level.
Try as far as possible to keep to the topic. The discussions are sometimes naturally drifting away from the initial topic. In this case it is preferable to start a new topic but with a referral to the previous topic in the first post.



Piano Forum is a moderated discussion board. Although all postings are immediately displayed everything is eventually read by our moderators. Their work is to keep the boards and topics as clean as possible without interfering to much with the discussions. They have the right to delete posts which are regarded inappropriate and to delete old topics that does not contain useful information.
Please respect their work as it is only to provide a better service for you.


We hope that you, by sticking to these rules, will help Piano Forum to remain the best resource for pianists on the Internet.

/The Piano Forum Team

Now, these rules seem quite vague to me, so I think that we, as a forum, should post ideas as to how they be changed.  And, if nils agrees with them, then we couldinstate them in the hope that confusions happen no more. 

I guess I will start out with a few:

1) Make sure you put your topic in the right board.  "tornados" does not belong in repertoire.

2) Do not bump your thread after less than 24 hours of non-activity on it.  If people have nothing to say, then they won't answer your thread.

3) No "bad" threads.  This is where the most confusion seems to occur, so I think we need to specify what criteria these threads have:
     a. No advertisements.  If I see someone with 5 posts come in and create a thread about how great a certain site is and how we all should join it, I get suspicious as to what his true intentions are.
     b. Try tour best to refain from creating threads that have already been discussed.  It is always better to add on to a year old thread than to create a new one.
     c. Before you create a thread, sit back and think: is this thread conversation worthy.  tds (I will just use you as an example, you are just the first that comes to mind) created a thread about hoe he wanted his member status to go down so he looked "younger"
     
4) Do not make a typo in one post, and then 30 seconds later make a new post that says "Oops, I spelt car wrong, sorry"  Simply use the "Modify"button.

5) I like this one: 

Try as far as possible to keep to the topic. The discussions are sometimes naturally drifting away from the initial topic. In this case it is preferable to start a new topic but with a referral to the previous topic in the first post

Well, that's all that I've got for now.  I hope you all put some thoughtful discussion into this matter.


EDIT:  Darn, I should have made this under a different title.  Now people are just going to think it's about how cool the PF is.

[mikeyg]

Here is where I will keep an updated list of everything we decide, so we can keep track of things.

[xvimbi]

Frankly, I don't see a need to change anything. We have had bumpy rides over the years; some people suggested to install moderators. In the end, we all decided to leave things as they were, and things ended up being just fine. At this point, there is nothing that would really warrant any change (IMO).

[mikeyg]

Frankly, I don't see a need to change anything. We have had bumpy rides over the years; some people suggested to install moderators. In the end, we all decided to leave things as they were, and things ended up being just fine. At this point, there is nothing that would really warrant any change (IMO).

There is nothing wrong with preventative action.  The rules that we would make would not effect the worthy threads of the piano forum, so absolutely no negative would come of it.  Only good things can happen if the rules are fair.
 
The more our site grows, the more risk of there being someone who does "bad" things:  taunting, advertising, harassing, etc.

Granted, nothing ridiculous has happened, but I've noticed a somewhat downward trend in the few months I've been here, and you must have seen an even bigger effect, due to your length of stay. 

Like I said, only good can come of revising the rules, and people like tds won't be confused.

[fred smalls]

Mike.  I repest you, but why do you care so much about this stuff?  Nils has got everything under control, and the sever is fine.  Your not running the forum.  So can you just chill about all this. I am not trying to offend, i mean, why does this matter so much to you?

[mikeyg]

I don't know why I care so much about it.  I just do. 

Is there any rules I though of that are really that crazy?  I mean, I think they are pretty fair.  So I don't really see what I need to chill out about. 

Not to mention, I only created this thread because tds complained about how unspecific the rules were.


EDIT: I am not trying to offend you or anyone else.

[fred smalls]

Yeah.  Your rules seem pretty reasonable.  But they're not fun.  If this forum becomes all serious, then no one will want to post or join.  I think with stricter rules, the fun will be taken out of this forum.  I will admit there are some really pointless threads, but, for the most part, what you find useless is the some of the light humor (note my sarcastic post when we were arch enemies, lol). Anyway, thats just my feeling on the matter.  Maybe there should be a vote or something...

Peace
Fred

[mikeyg]

I would set up a poll if the darned things worked... 

[fred smalls]

I would set up a poll if the darned things worked... 

Heh...

I posted two threads on the subject of polls.  One in pf website and one in repretoire (becuase no one ever look in pf website, lol).  But not many people replied.  Not sure if I bumped it, heh, breaking all your rules Mikey...
Anyway, polls would be absolutely amazing if we could get them up and running...

[tds]

  tds (I will just use you as an example, you are just the first that comes to mind)

i seem to always be the first that comes to your mind. *clears throat*tds

[tds]

i seem to always be the first that comes to your mind. *clears throat*tds

 

[mikeyg]

No, don't wotty, you are not.  I think some of Bob's threads are a bit, well, odd.  I just used you as an example because I had just read your post. 

[tds]

thanks for putting a smiley after your text. i could relate well with it. oh btw, i think bob's really cool. i don't see anything odd about him ( well, not yet! )

tds

ps. are you still thinking about me now?

[mikeyg]

ps. are you still thinking about me now?

No, I'm thinking about this Java program I am writing.

[tds]

No, I'm thinking about this Java program I am writing.

oh, lemme think about it, too. tds*hopes to help mike by shared thinking*

[fred smalls]

You guys realize you has turned this into useless pointless bable??? Not that I care, I just think its really really funny, considering this whole topic is about stoping what it has turned in to!! Mike, you should be ashamed of yourself

PS: Bob is cool, if you took away his posts I'd kill you and myself... 

[tds]

Mike, you should be ashamed of yourself

mike was joking all the way. no, mike?

PS: Bob is cool, if you took away his posts I'd kill you and myself...

oh, oh. will you kill your cat, too? oh wait, do you have a cat?

[Hmoll]

Recently, a PF member has complained about his posts being deleted, and said that the rules needed to be much more specific.  I didn't realise what he was talking about until I actually looked at the rules.  Here they are:

Now, these rules seem quite vague to me, so I think that we, as a forum, should post ideas as to how they be changed.  And, if nils agrees with them, then we couldinstate them in the hope that confusions happen no more. 

I guess I will start out with a few:

1) Make sure you put your topic in the right board.  "tornados" does not belong in repertoire.

2) Do not bump your thread after less than 24 hours of non-activity on it.  If people have nothing to say, then they won't answer your thread.

3) No "bad" threads.  This is where the most confusion seems to occur, so I think we need to specify what criteria these threads have:
     a. No advertisements.  If I see someone with 5 posts come in and create a thread about how great a certain site is and how we all should join it, I get suspicious as to what his true intentions are.
     b. Try tour best to refain from creating threads that have already been discussed.  It is always better to add on to a year old thread than to create a new one.
     c. Before you create a thread, sit back and think: is this thread conversation worthy.  tds (I will just use you as an example, you are just the first that comes to mind) created a thread about hoe he wanted his member status to go down so he looked "younger"
     
4) Do not make a typo in one post, and then 30 seconds later make a new post that says "Oops, I spelt car wrong, sorry"  Simply use the "Modify"button.

5) I like this one: 
Well, that's all that I've got for now.  I hope you all put some thoughtful discussion into this matter.


EDIT:  Darn, I should have made this under a different title.  Now people are just going to think it's about how cool the PF is.

Did Nils ask for any help?

The forum seems to be working just fine. If there's a problem, Nils addresses it. Sometimes it's better to have fewer rules, or ones that are purposely vague.

[SteinwayTony]

I'm with Hmoll.  There is nothing wrong with this forum, although I get a sense that certain users are (a) here for all the wrong reasons, and (b) here way more than they should be, compromising their potential practice hours.

As far as this post goes, all I see is two users in a tiff like two passive-aggressive schoolgirls.  Maybe you both need a break.

[mikeyg]

Maybe you both need a break.

Fine. *** you.  nils, ban me for 2 weeks, so I can finish out this semester strong in school, And so I can calm down over *** faces like Steinway Tony.

[mikeyg]

Oh, and can I have a big assed BANNED under my post count?  That would be awesome.

[fred smalls]

I'm with Hmoll.  There is nothing wrong with this forum, although I get a sense that certain users are (a) here for all the wrong reasons, and (b) here way more than they should be, compromising their potential practice hours.

As far as this post goes, all I see is two users in a tiff like two passive-aggressive schoolgirls.  Maybe you both need a break.

Yeah, Mike, just take a break from caring about rules.  They're fine right now.  So just talk about piano.... instead of technical stuff...

[lagin]

I think mik had a great suggestion.  I'm not bothered either way, but I too have noticed a downward spiral in the past couple of months.  so much so, that I'm actually starting to gradually lose interest in the forum a wee bit, to be honest.  If I want to chat, I'll chat, but if I want to learn I'll come here.  Maybe we could keep things such as 'piano monkeys' in the anything but piano zone.  Granted, it does relate to piano, but only in an oppinionated, nonconstructive, kind a way.  Yah, I'll probably get nailed for this one .

[dinosaurtales]

BOYZ!

I think it depends on who is posting in a particular timeframe.  There is quite a mix of ages and (a-HEM) maturity on this board.  So some of mikeyg's complaints are valid if it's a week where the too-cool school kids are posting silly stuff anywhere they like.  If the more serious folks are posting, who are seeking info, or providing some, the board is more accessible and sensible.

So stop it already!  And nils, DON'T ban mikeyg.  It's like the briar patch!

[donjuan]

Who is this mickey??  Is it my imagination or does he take anal retentive control freak to a whole new level? 

He has some very unreasonable rules - for example,

"Try tour best to refain from creating threads that have already been discussed.  It is always better to add on to a year old thread than to create a new one.
"

What?? Is this guy expecting new members to go through the thousands of threads from the past 4 years to make sure he's not repeating history?

and speaking of bad threads, what about this one??   

[pianomann1984]

Who is this mickey??  Is it my imagination or does he take anal retentive control freak to a whole new level? 

He has some very unreasonable rules - for example,

"Try tour best to refain from creating threads that have already been discussed.  It is always better to add on to a year old thread than to create a new one.
"

What?? Is this guy expecting new members to go through the thousands of threads from the past 4 years to make sure he's not repeating history?

Actually, I don't mean to rain on your parade, but there is a search facility here.  All you have to do is type your potential subject into it and *poof!* up they all me!  I do agree though that we should keep some fun here - alot of the time I come here to get away from practice - subjects like Bob's snail race (Sorry Bob: 1st one that comes to mind! ) provide some welcome relief from the many stresses of practicing.  This is partly what the Anything but piano board is for, i think!

I think mikey's rules just need a little adapting - I have also felt a slight lapse in sensibility on the forum's more seriously inclined rooms.

Some good ideas here,

Chris

[mikeyg]

This is my most favorite thread ever.  Mikeyg was quite a cool cat.  Very admirable.  I want to marry him.

[JCarey]

This is my most favorite thread ever.  Mikeyg was quite a cool cat.  Very admirable.  I want to marry him.

Yes, it was a shame that he had to delete his account. He posted a lot on my forum, but he seemed to momentarily return to Piano Forum again. Now all traces of him have disappeared! 

[mikeyg]

Yes, it was a shame that he had to delete his account. He posted a lot on my forum, but he seemed to momentarily return to Piano Forum again. Now all traces of him have disappeared!

\

Tis a tragedy of the greatest magnitude.  Maybe he has summer couses which are taking up too much of his time...

[mikeyg]

Hey, did anyone reas the new rules?  remarkably similar to what I had posted here.  So haha.

hahahahaha

[TheHammer]

Some of the rules are pretty... well, unrealistic:

" You may not post words or URLs that are censored by adding spaces, dots, or substituting characters, or by any other means attempt to defeat any censors put in place by Piano Forum."

Half of the forum would have to be banned.

This one does not seem to be respected either (perhaps because noone knows the rules?):

" This includes discussion of activities such as music and software piracy and other intellectual property violations."

Anyone linking to dascd would have to be banned as well:

 "You may not post content, or in any manner link to sites or images, containing pornography, sexually explicit, gross violence, politically or religiously offensive material, or are determined by moderators to be detrimental to the community."

As well as:
 "Don't use all caps or special characters to draw attention."
 "Do not post if you have nothing valuable to add to the discussion. R efrain from posting meaningless threads, one word (or short) non-sense posts, or the such."   

And, oh lol, I think you would need dozens of moderators to assert this:

" Political and religious discussions are not allowed in the piano boards. If such issues are discussed in the “Anything but piano” board it is of extreme importance to avoid any kind of personal attacks or offences as well as such intended against a group of people. Only postings that are objectively discussing the issue with well backed up facts are allowed."

Good that noone cares. (About the literal rules. The forum as it is now, and that is  often disregarding some of the stated rules, is good.)

If someone DOES care actually (), Forum Rules to be found here:
https://www.pianoforum.net/forumrules.php

[nilsjohan]

The new rules have been up online for a little more than a week but have not yet been officially announced.

The new rules are not at all unrealistic but necessary to assure that members of all ages and all cultures can feel comfortable in the forum. Also, as the site grows the legal demands grows, as well as the demands to retain a professional attitude.  Everyone might not agree, but it is a fact.

The new rules do not at all mean that half the forum will get banned. Banning is something that will happen to them who break the rules and ignore reprimands and warnings.

Actually, the rules are nothing else than common sense combined with some obvious legal limitations.

[TheHammer]

I have nothing against rules for an internet forum, especially for this one. And I appreciate that you try to ensure politeness and tolerance concerning interaction between forum members.

Nevertheless, I think writing things like "darn", or "dang", or even "sh*t", is so common nowadays it will be hard to assert to forbid it.

Also, the "no offenses" etc. things are a bit uncertain if you know what I mean. Sure, someone who is constantly insulting anyone should get banned. But "heated discussions" are a part of the forum, insults will occur, even only through misunderstandings or the like. It is common sense that people should be able to talk to each other in a respectful way no matter the situation. Unfortunately, "common sense" and "people" are two things that meet quite rarely.

Of course I know noone will get banned right away if he/she just one time makes something wrong. But I just doubt that everyone will hold to the rules all the time (the "non-sense" sentence posts for example...).

So, I was just referring to the literal rules. As I see it, these are supposed to be guidelines for the "perfect member", and the moderator (that would be you) is supposed to assess the breach of the rules according to his understanding of the situation (as you have done in the past so wonderfully). If that's how it is meant, than I see no problem. If you want to realise the rules "literally", well, good luck...

[mikeyg]

Why haven't they been announced?  You're going to enforce them but not tell people about it?  That makes no sense, and is uncool.

[nilsjohan]

As I see it, these are supposed to be guidelines for the "perfect member", and the moderator (that would be you) is supposed to assess the breach of the rules according to his understanding of the situation (as you have done in the past so wonderfully). If that's how it is meant, than I see no problem.

Yes, that is exactly how it is meant. Mainly as something to refer to instead of trying to explain what common sense is to certain problematic members...

Why haven't they been announced? You're going to enforce them but not tell people about it? That makes no sense, and is uncool.

What is the problem? They are not containing any significant differeneces from the previous rules and agreement.

[mikeyg]

a) the agreement isn't viewable after you accept it, and people forget it, and b), these are tremendously different than the  old rules.

[nilsjohan]

a) the agreement isn't viewable after you accept it, and people forget it, and b), these are tremendously different than the  old rules.

a) If you agree to a legal document it is your responsibility to either remember it or keep it in printed form. But it is of course a good idea to make it available on the site. I will set it up!
b) I do not agree on that, they are just more detailed (but I include the agreement in my statement).