Enough is Enough and you are right

[BoliverAllmon]

I keep hearing the statement that says, "if you are so pro-military and America why don't you join?" well, I use to make all sorts of excuses and stuff, but no more. I quit my piano lessons and joined the army. I leave for Ft. Jackson, South Carolina for boot camp around mid-september. I am proud to be an American and I am proud to serve my country.

boliver

[tds]

wow, boliver! u got guts and balls. we proud of you!

[da jake]

All I can say is: Wow. 

Take care out there.   

[Kassaa]

Lawl.

[living_stradivarius]

I keep hearing the statement that says, "if you are so pro-military and America why don't you join?" well, I use to make all sorts of excuses and stuff, but no more. I quit my piano lessons and joined the army. I leave for Ft. Jackson, South Carolina for boot camp around mid-september. I am proud to be an American and I am proud to serve my country.

boliver

Were you pressured by people in pianoforum to join? Or was it more personal than that?

[pianistimo]

200 people from iran also joined.  but, they are walking in flipflops across turkey (if allowed) and picking up their weapons later.  not sure if turkey is letting them cross - but as i understand it - if you come from iran - you can live in turkey three months (no passport needed). 

look at it this way.  you are not fighting the palestinians only or the iraqis only.  you are fighting terrorists from iran, turky, syria.  it is massive and getting larger by the day.  unless we have a UN resolution behind us and a lot of support from them - it's a lost cause.  what do we want.  a nuclear explosion in the middle east?  what good would that do.  this is like a nightmare that reoccurs worse each time.

may God defend all those that call on his name (including you Boliver) - just realize that when you go over there you might be shocked at what others have considered a living condition since birth.  these people do have a reason to fight because their way of living is being radically reformed.  they do not want western ways - and yet - to function in a new world society they are forced to by government.  it is painful on both sides because innocent civilians are being hurt, too.  i hope you are a good representation of the USA and never aim at civilians.  and, that you pray each and every time before firing.  a wounded soldier cannot fire (i've experienced a broken leg - all your attention moves to the extremity).  dead soldiers are really nothing to brag about.  they are people too, and seeing many on both sides proves how pointless war is.

[mephisto]

I remember something about not killing in the Bible.

[thalbergmad]

I remember something about not killing in the Bible.

Indeed, but if it is done in the name of God and you are serving the purpose of God, you can massacre millions and still go to heaven.

[zheer]

  Killing on a batelfield is'nt necessarily a crime, obviously it might be a crime depending on method and objective.

[mephisto]

Indeed, but if it is done in the name of God and you are serving the purpose of God, you can massacre millions and still go to heaven.

Why didn`t I think about that

[bernhard]

I remember something about not killing in the Bible.

Killjoy.

[bernhard]

  Killing on a batelfield is'nt necessarily a crime, obviously it might be a crime depending on method and objective.

Phew! I guess thatīs all right then...

[bernhard]

wow, boliver! u got guts and balls. 

Maybe not for long...

[bernhard]

200 people from iran also joined.  but, they are walking in flipflops across turkey (if allowed) and picking up their weapons later. 

Flipflops can be deadly weapons in the right hands. Perhaps we should consider anyone wearing flipflops a terrorist . Besides they are hurting Americaīs economic interests by not wearing Nike.

Actually, why not consider anyone behaving normally a terrorist and shoot them for no real reason. Just as they did to that Brazilian chap in London? Even if your attempts at a cover-up and at blaming the victim for an alleged (and later proved completely false) suspicious behaviour are shamefully revealed, you will still get away with it. The officers (do they work at the office?) are apparently back on the streets and everything is business as usual.

Wait? Shooting and bombing inocent people who are getting on with their lives and them telling the world they are terrorists or harbouring terrorists, or sympathising with terrorism? Wasnīt something like that in the papers recently?

Samuel Johnson used to say that patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel. Maybe the definition should be extended to terrorism: all a scoundrel has to do to defend his indefensible actions is to bring forth a charge of terrorism.

Best wishes,
Bernhard.
 

[ada]

It's with sadness that I read this post. (If there was an emoticon describing sincerity I'd use it here).

Excuse my ignorance about us military matters but does that mean you'll see active service? And how soon?

[BoliverAllmon]

It's with sadness that I read this post. (If there was an emoticon describing sincerity I'd use it here).

Excuse my ignorance about us military matters but does that mean you'll see active service? And how soon?

I will see active service. probably january or so. PS forum did not persuade me, I had a lot of other personal reasons for joining.

boliver

[Kassaa]

You love your country, so you join a war to rape another country? Way to go.

[prometheus]

I hope they send you to a quiet place oversea so you can see something of the world and become a more balanced person.

It they send you to a war area where you will see 'action' you may return with a scarred mind.

[BoliverAllmon]

You love your country, so you join a war to rape another country? Way to go.

 

[BoliverAllmon]

the death rate is not that high compared to other wars. I am not scared to die. I could be killed any other day of my life by just walking outside or driving a car.

Do I agree with everything the military does? NO! do I agree with everything the administration does? NO! but I still see alot of good that we do and I want to be a part of it.

boliver

[Kassaa]

the death rate is not that high compared to other wars. I am not scared to die. I could be killed any other day of my life by just walking outside or driving a car.

Do I agree with everything the military does? NO! do I agree with everything the administration does? NO! but I still see alot of good that we do and I want to be a part of it.

boliver

Lololololol, I hope you enjoy yourself in Abu Ghraib.

[BoliverAllmon]

Lololololol, I hope you enjoy yourself in Abu Ghraib.

I bet I will

[Kassaa]

I bet I will

I am sure you will.

[bella musica]

Good show, Boliver!  Don't let anybody make you feel like you are a sadistic serial killer for joining the army.  There is nothing at all wrong with being willing to stand up and fight to defend your country.  The only people who will make fun of a decision like that are the ones who don't have the guts or the brains to do it themselves, and it seems to me like they are perfectly happy not to have snipers sitting in trees waiting to shoot them as they walk out the door, because they are not muslims.
 
There is a lot of wrong in our world today.  I know that you would never truly WANT to kill another human being, but sometimes you have to choose the lesser of two evils.  On 9/11, radical muslims hi-jacked 4 jets full of innocent passengers and crashed them into buildings containing thousands of other civilians.  They had not previously declared war on us.  They did not care that they killed hundreds of innocent people.  If we can do anything to stop that from happening again, we should, and you are doing what you feel to be your part in that.  God be with you.

[pathetiquegirl]

hey Boliver,
   thank for stannding up for us.   will you keep me up to date?  i will keep emailing you, sry i haven't for a bit.

path

[prometheus]

Joining the army doesn't equal standing up for your country. It means hiring yourself out to the government to kill people and to risk your life.


Since in the army you will just have to follow orders I don't really see how you can stand up for anyone.

[pathetiquegirl]

boy you make joining the army sound like nothing......he is giving away his life by his on choice.......he is saying "i will stand to protect and defend the people of the United States of America"......yes sir he is standin up for me.....he's standing up for all the american people.....i am proud to say he's a true american boy

best wishes,
path

[prometheus]

Actually, it is the other way around. If he was giving his life for his family and friends it would be easier. But he is giving his life to the government. The wars in Iraq and Afghanistan have decreased the safety of the people in the US. Thanks to the government and their soldiers US is now less safe. The US government has even admitted this.

So now he is hiring himself out, running the risk of killing people and dying himself, to lower your safety and that of the other american people.

Now if you want to be proud and thankful about that, fine. But he isn't standing up for you.


If he wants to protect and defend the american people he shouldn't be joining the army.

[bernhard]

Actually, it is the other way around. If he was giving his life for his family and friends it would be easier. But he is giving his life to the government.

And a particularly corrupt government at that.

[rimv2]

I keep hearing the statement that says, "if you are so pro-military and America why don't you join?" well, I use to make all sorts of excuses and stuff, but no more. I quit my piano lessons and joined the army. I leave for Ft. Jackson, South Carolina for boot camp around mid-september. I am proud to be an American and I am proud to serve my country.

boliver

Right on,

You mah *** fo life

Actually, it is the other way around. If he was giving his life for his family and friends it would be easier. But he is giving his life to the government. The wars in Iraq and Afghanistan have decreased the safety of the people in the US. Thanks to the government and their soldiers US is now less safe. The US government has even admitted this.

So now he is hiring himself out, running the risk of killing people and dying himself, to lower your safety and that of the other american people.

Now if you want to be proud and thankful about that, fine. But he isn't standing up for you.


If he wants to protect and defend the american people he shouldn't be joining the army.

Joining the army does not mean hes adding to the problem. Especially if he gets stationed somewhere not in the middle east.  Expressing negativity through logic seems to be one of your strong points, Ya jerk.

I always hate to agree with the man in the office, But tomorrow will decide whether or not the actions in the middle east are for better or worse- Not today. And if one soldier can make a difference- Cowboy up!!!

[prometheus]

Did I say it would add to the problem? And I already expressed myself that I hope that after his initial training he gets send somewhere safe.

[bella musica]

Joining the army doesn't equal standing up for your country. It means hiring yourself out to the government to kill people and to risk your life.


Since in the army you will just have to follow orders I don't really see how you can stand up for anyone.

Yes and no.  While I suppose some people might join the army with those purposes in mind, I don't think Boliver is.  You don't have to be a 'lone ranger' movie-type hero to stand up for something.  Maybe joining the army is a part of how someone stands up for their country.

I'd be interested in hearing how you would plan to protect and defend the American people with no army.  (Although it appears that you  think the world would be better off if we were wiped off the face of the earth by a nuclear attack.)

[jakev2.0]

Soldiers getting killed in Iraq - giving their lives for a "corrupt government"?

Try:

Soldiers getting killed in Iraq - giving their lives for the establishment of a stable, consensual democracy where none existed before.

[BoliverAllmon]

Soldiers getting killed in Iraq - giving their lives for a "corrupt government"?

Try:

Soldiers getting killed in Iraq - giving their lives for the establishment of a stable, consensual democracy where none existed before.

thank you. I also look at it this way, if we were doing such a bad job in Iraq, why did the PM of Iraq call on our Congress to send more troops and more money to continue the great work we are doing there?

If joining the army is not the way to support and protect america, then what is?

boliver

[Kassaa]

Good show, Boliver!  Don't let anybody make you feel like you are a sadistic serial killer for joining the army.  There is nothing at all wrong with being willing to stand up and fight to defend your country.  The only people who will make fun of a decision like that are the ones who don't have the guts or the brains to do it themselves, and it seems to me like they are perfectly happy not to have snipers sitting in trees waiting to shoot them as they walk out the door, because they are not muslims.
 
There is a lot of wrong in our world today.  I know that you would never truly WANT to kill another human being, but sometimes you have to choose the lesser of two evils.  On 9/11, radical muslims hi-jacked 4 jets full of innocent passengers and crashed them into buildings containing thousands of other civilians.  They had not previously declared war on us.  They did not care that they killed hundreds of innocent people.  If we can do anything to stop that from happening again, we should, and you are doing what you feel to be your part in that.  God be with you.

OWWWW 3 years of war has obviously helped, the world is a lot safer now!

thank you. I also look at it this way, if we were doing such a bad job in Iraq, why did the PM of Iraq call on our Congress to send more troops and more money to continue the great work we are doing there?

If joining the army is not the way to support and protect america, then what is?

boliver

OMG, are you really that naive?

And, there's not a way to support and protect America, what are you doing in Iraq what's really a good thing? What have you achieved? You have turned a horrible but organised country in a horribly and chaotic country. It's not like you can prevent suicide bombers or something, the only thing you do is making everything worse, making more people hate the western world, which results in more bombings.

THANK YOU AMERICA

[jakev2.0]

OWWWW 3 years of war has obviously helped, the world is a lot safer now!

Presently,

Is Iraq, under the control of a genocidal maniac?

NO

Is it still actively pursuing the acqusition of WMD (which the Iraq Survey Group stated was the regime's main strategic goal)?

No

Is the world safer with Saddam out of power?

YES.
 
Is there a bloody insurgency in Iraq, presently?

YES.

For the Future

Can it be won?

YES.

Will Iraq be better off afterwards?

Yes.

[steve jones]

OWWWW 3 years of war has obviously helped, the world is a lot safer now!
OMG, are you really that naive?

And, there's not a way to support and protect America, what are you doing in Iraq what's really a good thing? What have you achieved? You have turned a horrible but organised country in a horribly and chaotic country. It's not like you can prevent suicide bombers or something, the only thing you do is making everything worse, making more people hate the western world, which results in more bombings.

THANK YOU AMERICA

If you understood why the US runs its foreign policy as it does, then I could take your comments way more seriously.

But as it is, none of us understand global economics or the dynamics of world politics. So how can we really critisise when what we dont get?

I mean, I would prefer it if they told us the truth once in a while. But then again, maybe I wouldnt want to know the truth?

What would have said if G W had announced that unless the US invades Iraq, it might go into economic melt down and that you would probably wind up living in a box and eating dog for tea?

So while its all very fashionable to take this uber left anti US stance, I find it a little childish.

And B, you have my utmost respect for putting your money where you mouth is girl! Well done.

SJ

[Kassaa]

Presently,

Is Iraq, under the control of a genocidal maniac?

NO

Is it still actively pursuing the acqusition of WMD (which the Iraq Survey Group stated was the regime's main strategic goal)?

No

Is the world safer with Saddam out of power?

YES.
 
Is there a bloody insurgency in Iraq, presently?

YES.

For the Future

Can it be won?

YES.

Will Iraq be better off afterwards?

Yes.

Better one genocidal maniac who has control than 100.000 who want it. World safer without Sadam? I see, a lot less attacks by Muslim extremists, stupid I didn't see it.

For the future, how do you want to win the war against Muslim extremism?

[jakev2.0]

Better one genocidal maniac who has control than 100.000 who want it.

Not really. Last time I checked, no one person in Iraq had the desire or capability to rain hell upon it's neighbors (or it's own people for that matter) on a massive scale.

For the future, how do you want to win the war against Muslim extremism?

Easy. The same way other ideologies like Nazism and Japanese Militarism were defeated: by making them irrlevent by seeing to it their followers are utterly defeated. Chamberlain (UN) or Churchill (US/Israel)...you decide.

[living_stradivarius]

Bend down and give me 80! 

[gruffalo]

i think it is brave what you are doing, not for joining the army, but for standing up to yourself. however, i have the feeling that if you explain this story and show how patriotic you are, most blokes in the army will probably laugh at you.

Gruff

[prometheus]

thank you. I also look at it this way, if we were doing such a bad job in Iraq, why did the PM of Iraq call on our Congress to send more troops and more money to continue the great work we are doing there?

The Iraqi people want the US troops out. The majority supports withdrawel. A large part even supports violence against the US occupation.

The invasion of Iraq was a terrible war crime that would get you hanged following Nuremberg principles.

If joining the army is not the way to support and protect america, then what is?

Protect the US from who? What has Iraq to do with the safety of american people? Hussian didn't have any power over his army, north Iraq, east Iraq. How could he strike the US? Not even Kuwaiti people were afraid of Iraq. But American people were. Actually, a lot of Fox viewing people thought that Iraq was behind 9/11 which of course is false.


Safety of american people? They are already quite safe. If you want to increase safety of people you need to look elsewere. And if you want to protect american citizens then join the police. Then you will be enforcing law in america. Not defending the foreign interests of your government.

Support america? You mean the american government? Most of what the american government does is not supported by the population. If you want to support the american population you need to get the american government to govern more in the consensus of the people.

But there are other ways. Become an activist. For example for human rights. Human rights are violated by all governments. Become a local politican. Become an enviromentalist. Become a member of a social movement. Surely there are poor people around your area. Become a nurse, elderly and sick people need help.

[BoliverAllmon]

i think it is brave what you are doing, not for joining the army, but for standing up to yourself. however, i have the feeling that if you explain this story and show how patriotic you are, most blokes in the army will probably laugh at you.

Gruff

nah, I have several family members that are in the military and they are all there on some form of patriotism. Most soldiers are. They love there country and want to serve it.

boliver

[BoliverAllmon]

And B, you have my utmost respect for putting your money where you mouth is girl! Well done.

SJ

I am a guy not a chick.

boliver

[BoliverAllmon]

The Iraqi people want the US troops out. The majority supports withdrawel. A large part even supports violence against the US occupation.

The invasion of Iraq was a terrible war crime that would get you hanged following Nuremberg principles.

who says the majority wants us out? If the people elected a certain government and that government is asking for our help, wouldn't that mean that we should help?

No, Iraq and 9/11 are not intertwined. They are seperate things.

boliver

[prometheus]

Polls showing the opinion of the Iraqi people. The fact that the Iraqi government does want american soldiers tells you they are not democratic, or not democratic enough. The US would never implement a government in Iraq that throws them out. So this is only natural.

Yes, 9/11 and Iraq had nothing to do with this. US government admitted this. But there were quite some things the US government said that implied or suggested a connection. The result was that a large part of Fox viewers thought that this was the truth. Also, american people really feared Iraq, while their military buget was 1/3 that of Kuwait. Now look at the map and compare the sizes. Iraq was by far the weakest military power in the region. And it showed. The Iraqi military collapsed almost instantly.

Now religious extremists, people Hussain would have tortured to death the moment they entered area he controlled, plus some baathists fight an insurgency. And they can do so because a minority, but a significant part, supports violence against american people. Also, there is a power struggle between shi'ite ans sunnis. Al Quada attacks shi'ite mosques. This is why Hezbollah hates Al Quada and this is why they do not use suicide attacks like Hamas. It's against their ideology.

Shi'ite: Hezbollah, Iran, Iraq.
Sunni: Al Quada, Palestine, Saudi Arabia, Baath&Hussain, Hamas

[steve jones]

I am a guy not a chick.

boliver

No sh*t?

I was sure Id watched one of your vids. Oops, must be the other Boliver...

Well in that case, good luck mate and when you get back have a pint on me 

SJ

[stevie]

I am a guy not a chick.

boliver

No ***?

I was sure Id watched one of your vids. Oops, must be the other Boliver...

Well in that case, good luck mate and when you get back have a pint on me

SJ

HAHAHAH genius

[arensky]

Good luck.

I hope you come back and resume your music.

[thalbergmad]

Good luck.

I hope you come back and resume your music.

If he still has his hands.