The Games Women Play

[jlh]

Ever wonder why women play games with the guys they're interested in?  One girl told me it is because the girl "wants to be wanted", and the attention she gets from playing games fulfills that desire.  I have a problem with games, namely the fact that the guy always becomes the loser, even if he passes the test.  The games are designed by the girl so that she always wins.  If she doesn't win, the guy still loses, in that she doesn't want to see him anymore.  If a girl wants to know she's wanted, she should wait for the phone call or to be asked out on a date.  Guys are simple, if we want you we will call you.  Girls read so much into every situation that it actually screws up any chance of a sane outcome. 

What are some of your experiences with these types of games?  What games do women play? 

[ronde_des_sylphes]

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[pianowolfi]

Women that really care about you don't play games. Btw there are men that play games as well.

[matterintospirit]

In my experiecne most if not all game playing is a response to some underlying fear. In the case you are talking about, it's fear of rejection. Often with fear of rejection, the person doesn't like themself, not confident in self etc. No matter how much you show you care, like them, love them, think highly of them, etc. (be they a man or woman), they will not accept or beleive you. However, if you treat such a person badly, they are likely to get "turned on." So. if just sex is what you are after, that's a good tactic. However for a relationship, the trick is to meet someone who likes themself, feels comfortable with self, etc. Not so easy , but a lot more fun.
   And as pianowolfi pointed out, this behavior can be observed in men as well. I have seen quite a few men who are with their girlfiends and wives because the women push them around and insult them. I've observed this behavior in gay relationships as well. So I guess it's a universal.  I, personally, don't take that crap.

[rimv2]

Ever wonder why women play games with the guys they're interested in?  One girl told me it is because the girl "wants to be wanted", and the attention she gets from playing games fulfills that desire.  I have a problem with games, namely the fact that the guy always becomes the loser, even if he passes the test (for instance i found out recently that a girl i dated a few months ago lied to a friend of mine to see how i would react -- the lie being that she was seeing another guy when in reality she wasn't).  The games are designed by the girl so that she always wins.  If she doesn't win, the guy still loses, in that she doesn't want to see him anymore.  If a girl wants to know she's wanted, she should wait for the phone call or to be asked out on a date.  Guys are simple, if we want you we will call you.  Girls read so much into every situation that it actually screws up any chance of a sane outcome. 

What are some of your experiences with this?  What games do women play?  Men, this thread is for us so we can inform each other and not fall victim to the games women play.

Details please...

Instead of wondering why women play games. Just don't play them. The only way to pass a test where every outcome is failure is to not take the test to begin with. Don't get too involved, or too attached. In today's world love is just a verb. Most people are afraid or insecure to give themselves in a way that forms a meaningful connection. Sounds a bit cynical, but unfortunately, it's the truth.

Also, her playing games means she doesn't respect you as a man. Either change your partner, or change something within yourself. If the relationships already done, it's probably for the better.

[counterpoint]

In my experiecne most if not all game playing is a response to some underlying fear.

Interesting theory  

But I think, it's not fear, it's pure cruelty  

Some people do really enjoy it to see, how others are tortured and how they are in a state of despair.

[prometheus]

This should be about board games and card games. Or even video games.

[jlh]

Instead of wondering why women play games. Just don't play them. The only way to pass a test where every outcome is failure is to not take the test to begin with. Don't get too involved, or too attached. In today's world love is just a verb. Most people are afraid or insecure to give themselves in a way that forms a meaningful connection. Sounds a bit cynical, but unfortunately, it's the truth.

Also, her playing games means she doesn't respect you as a man. Either change your partner, or change something within yourself. If the relationships already done, it's probably for the better.

Ok, I'm all for not playing games... however, how do you know it is a game she's playing and not simply real life?  If she's not playing a game and the guy decides it is a game and not real life then he loses again. 

[thalberg]

Well Josh, the key lies in knowing how to translate certain things.  For example, "be honest with me" really means "tell me what I want to hear."  And "we haven't resolved this yet" really means "I have not won yet."  It took me a very long time to figure this out.  Of course, now that I have figured it out, I do not use the knowledge, rather I avoid those types of women.  There are good women, and so I look for those.

I'd recommend reading the Mars and Venus book--it's great for normal misunderstandings.

For misunderstandings that seem like they come from the twilight zone, read up on Borderline Personality Disorder--75% of those who have it are women, and it will explain the actions of LOTS of women that you have met, trust me.  Read "I hate you, don't leave me" or "stop walking on eggshells"--those are two good books on the subject. 

I think a lot of women get themselves into trouble because they want certain things from men and handle it wrong.  Like for example, if they want to be told a certain thing affirming the relationship. But the man doesn't say it that day or that week or whatever.  So the woman asks him a bunch of questions getting him to say it, then when he says it she really knows it was only because she 'manufactured' the response.  So she doesn't believe him.  When he sees she doens't believe him, then he feels like he can't win because she tried to get something, he gave it to her, and she rejected it.

[matterintospirit]

Ok, I'm all for not playing games... however, how do you know it is a game she's playing and not simply real life?  If she's not playing a game and the guy decides it is a game and not real life then he loses again. 

Well, gee, games are a part of real life. They "really" exist. Your dilemna is starting to sound like a board game. If it feels like a game, then it is a game. And speaking of games, you are playing games with your head, it's enough already!

I have another opinion---- the Black Widow spider, as everyone knows, bites the head off of the male after mating---shocking The female cat sometimes beats the crap out of the male cat before sex. You see this behavior in a lot of species. So this type of "power balance" behavior may very well be genetic--a part of the mating "dance", a part of procreation. All this "purism" about sexual behavior, (and sex is what it boils down to), may just be barking up the wrong tree. I do feel that with all the progress, we are stiil basically animals, more than we know. The only thing that I'm 100% sure of is that, when it comes to playing games, I know of NO man who is a MATCH for ANY woman (myself included of course.)  To think so, in my opinion, would be  a "grave" miscalculation. 

[thalberg]

Ugh....matter you are so right.  No man can match any woman in game playing.  The best we can ever hope for is to protect ourselves from getting hurt.  And only the most ingenius and experienced men can even accomplish that.

[matterintospirit]

Ugh....matter you are so right.  No man can match any woman in game playing.  The best we can ever hope for is to protect ourselves from getting hurt.  And only the most ingenius and experienced men can even accomplish that.

 

[jlh]

Ugh....matter you are so right.  No man can match any woman in game playing.  The best we can ever hope for is to protect ourselves from getting hurt.  And only the most ingenius and experienced men can even accomplish that.

Yeah that's one of my problems... I tend to care too much too early. It's better than not caring at all, but figuring out how much to put out there at what time is a difficult like to walk.

[goldentone]

How early are the games starting?  I think the answer to that will shed
some light on things.

I like what Pianowolfi said.  These games indicate the kind of woman you are going out with.  There are better ways to "test the waters" and I believe there are women out there who don't have to resort to trickery, lying (red flag), or manipulation to see where the man's heart lies or to try to exert the wrong kind of power in the relationship.  As a Christian, you shouldn't have to put with that. 

[thalberg]

Yeah that's one of my problems... I tend to care too much too early. It's better than not caring at all, but figuring out how much to put out there at what time is a difficult like to walk.

Hmmm....so you're aware that you care too much too early.  If that's the case, it could be that women aren't playing games like you think.  Often, women don't want to hurt our feelings, so they disguise their motives when trying to pull away.  Like the old thing of making an excuse of a schedule conflict for not going on a date, when really they just don't have the courage to say they don't want to.  What you may be experiencing may be a milder form of this--the girl likes you, but not as much as you like her.  So she is evasive, puts a little distance between you here and there, does whatever she can to slow things down.  Just a guess.

[jlh]

Hmmm....so you're aware that you care too much too early.  If that's the case, it could be that women aren't playing games like you think.  Often, women don't want to hurt our feelings, so they disguise their motives when trying to pull away.  Like the old thing of making an excuse of a schedule conflict for not going on a date, when really they just don't have the courage to say they don't want to.  What you may be experiencing may be a milder form of this--the girl likes you, but not as much as you like her.  So she is evasive, puts a little distance between you here and there, does whatever she can to slow things down.  Just a guess.

Yeah, you've got a point there.  I'm not specifically talking about any one event I've personally experienced, though there are events I could mention.  I was recently talking about a few recent events with one of my girl-friends (not girlfriends lol), and she's like "yeah, girls do crazy things and i'm sometimes ashamed to be counted among them". lol 

Believe me I've had girls suddenly get extremely busy and then come to find out they've been seeing some other guy and now they're engaged or something like that.  I know all about that... and being stood up for dinner because they "forgot" and then they say "raincheck please" and it never happens...  There's nothing worse though than being attracted to someone who has you in their "friend zone".  Once you're in there, you had better not be attracted to them anymore or you will go mad or lose the friendship (watch the movie "just friends" or a few episodes of "friends").

There's nothing quite like spending time with a girl and everything seems to be going well but then the PMS happens and she want's nothing to do with you.  If that happens, my experience says that you should not come within 100m of her or you will not be getting any sugar for some time. lol

[thalberg]

Yeah, you've got a point there.  I'm not specifically talking about any one event I've personally experienced, though there are events I could mention.  I was recently talking about a few recent events with one of my girl-friends (not girlfriends lol), and she's like "yeah, girls do crazy things and i'm sometimes ashamed to be counted among them". lol 

Too true.  Just goes to show you they know what they're doing when they do it.

Believe me I've had girls suddenly get extremely busy and then come to find out they've been seeing some other guy and now they're engaged or something like that.  I know all about that... and being stood up for dinner because they "forgot" and then they say "raincheck please" and it never happens...  There's nothing worse though than being attracted to someone who has you in their "friend zone".  Once you're in there, you had better not be attracted to them anymore or you will go mad or lose the friendship (watch the movie "just friends" or a few episodes of "friends").

Yep, whether it's because you're in the friend zone or for some other reason, it's always best for us guys to "get a clue" when a woman doesn't want to date, and back off completely.  Too often we think that she really did have a schedule conflict and that if we just keep asking we'll get a "yes."  Not gonna happen.

There's nothing quite like spending time with a girl and everything seems to be going well but then the PMS happens and she want's nothing to do with you.  If that happens, my experience says that you should not come within 100m of her or you will not be getting any sugar for some time. lol

Hmm...I haven't experienced that.  My experience has been more with women who will not ever give me any space.  I don't mean I need lots of space, just a few minutes to do homework so I don't fail my classes.  Haha....I bet if I sent you some of the women I know, maybe you'd get along better with them.

Funny thing is, not all women are suffocating like the ones I tend to attract, nor are they all game-playing like the ones you mention.......it just seems like certain guys attract certain kinds of women.  I have a brother that attracts awesome women--cool personalities, no issues, no games.

Women have the same problem--some of them attract loser guys, and others tend to be luckier.  If only there were a way to choose whom we atttract...

[pianistimo]

i can't help but listen and wonder.  if anyone wants to try it - how about prayer?  i prayed finally (after being undeniably in uncontrolled infatuation with an attractive latin looking guy for about 2 years.  if he walked by my piano lessons door and looked in the window - i could not concentrate after that.  he would do this once a year - and only two other dates within the year.  i never knew when he would show up).  finally, i thought - who cares a smattering about seeing him with his shirt off playing what-was-that-game (squash)?  i never bothered.  if he was so fly-by-night - what motive did i have to see him with his shirt off?  this was before i was married, btw.  what i mean is that - there was an inkling of me that wanted to see him with his shirt off - but that was squelched when i met my husband.  he has a very nice chest btw, and nice strong arms.  not saying the other guy didn't - but i wasn't sure i could touch them.  maybe he would jump back or something.

so, then i pray to God one day - can you please send me a man who will just be a friend?  what i mean here is that the other guy was so elusive that i wasn't sure if he was friend or spy.  sure enough - he sends my husband who isn't put off on the first date when he asks 'do you have a boyfriend.'  i said 'yes' because i was sorta serious about the other guy but wasn't sure how he felt about me.  so i wait a few weeks and what do you know - my husband writes back.  i think - 'score one for an honest guy.'  even though i liked somebody else before him - he would fight for me like one of those knights in shining armour.  i neglected to tell him until the second letter that the other guy was somewhat of a hoax anyways. 

then, we start talking about what we like in each other - completly obviating any of our past dates and being completely unaware of time, matter, or brains after that.  it's funny how memories are still sweet of friendships before you marry.  i mean - i don't dislike the guy for being 'shy' or whatever.  it's just that if you really love someone - you'll probably tell them right then and there.  that's what my husband did - and i figured that it couldn't get any better than that - so why bother looking for any comparisons. women typically will go for a man who is communicative of their feelings - rather than bottles it up and makes them guess how they feel.

[Derek]

What age of women are you going for? If you're going after women less than 21 years of age approximately, you're in for trouble. Many women don't even mature emotionally till after about age 25. I'm 24, recently engaged to my dear Laurie, who is 27. If you've been dating younger women up til now, go after someone older...they often have had quite enough of games and will just be honest with you about their feelings. And they will be secure enough with themselves to know that being wanted by one man is enough (assuming that man is worthy of her, of course!)

[jlh]

Yes good point there.

I don't want this to be about me really.  In fact, I'd be happy if this thread were just about the different games that people have observed women playing.    What kinds of things have occured?

[thalberg]

I didn't like this post so I deleted it.

[ahinton]

i can't help but listen and wonder.  if anyone wants to try it - how about prayer?  i prayed finally (after being undeniably in uncontrolled infatuation with an attractive latin looking guy for about 2 years.

so, then i pray to God one day - can you please send me a man who will just be a friend?  what i mean here is that the other guy was so elusive that i wasn't sure if he was friend or spy.  sure enough - he sends my husband who isn't put off on the first date when he asks 'do you have a boyfriend.'

Yet more prayer - yet more God...

Best,

Alistair

[thalberg]

Yet more prayer - yet more God...

Best,

Alistair

Alistair, why don't you perhaps try praying to God for something and tell us how it turns out?  It would be nice to have someone new sharing their experiences with such things.

[ahinton]

Alistair, why don't you perhaps try praying to God for something and tell us how it turns out?  It would be nice to have someone new sharing their experiences with such things.

Thank you for the kind invitation, but my point here was to draw attention (as if enough was not already drawn) to yet another citation of a particular act of Christian practice in a thread that is not about that (except to the extent that pianistimo is a woman and the words "pray" and "play" do at least sound somewhat similar).

Anyway, I'm not sure that someone "on the outside" (so to speak) as I am would even be entitled to participate in such an experiment, really; credibility might be somewhat lacking. Whilst I am not disinterested in the concept of "prayer" as such, it seems to me to be akin to some kind of neurpsychological practice of which I know nothing and even neuroscientists know very little more as yet. Trying such a thing would therefore seem to me abit like trying to play the oboe and expecting to achieve and share results when one has never previously seen a wind instrument (not the best possible analogy, I'm sure, but the best I can think of right now)...

Best,

Alistair

[pianistimo]

as you've been so kind to alternately defend and attack - i shall now defend you alistair.  despite the fact you are still unmarried (the word 'still' typically reserved for mother's who want their children married) - you don't seem perturbed about it.  perhaps one of the responders in this thread was correct.  if you are happy with yourself - you don't see another person as necessarily 'completing you' as though you are a puzzle with many pieces missing.  if you can stand on your own and be comfortable with your own existence - then anyone can do anything and it doesn't really affect you.

for instance, if i wanted - i could play a game with alistair (*a very bad one since i'm married) and send him desperate pleas for a long-term plantonic relationship - of which i've thought tchaikovsky was most prudent to have.  and, that i would send him money every month - in return for tidbits of musical information such as he drops here on pianoforum.  but, i'm afraid alistair would be hurt by the fact that i might want to 'pay him' for his collective years of wisdom.  and, in fact - never say a word to me again.  thus - my game would have backfired.

now- the best game - as i see it - is to not even flirt.  i used to think flirting was harmless.  that is an oxymoron.  the moron part being that men never take flirting as anything but serious.  if you really want to get-it-on - get married.  that's my advice.  then, you can dress the part (or undress) and not suddenly say 'i don't think this is a good idea.'  people who do that should, imo - just have paid for a helium balloon and then let it go into the atmosphere for the experience of watching it fly away.

[mike_lang]

i could play a game with alistair (*a very bad one since i'm married) and send him desperate pleas for a long-term plantonic relationship -

Modeled after those of that great philosopher Planto, teacher of Erik Stottle and disciple of the great Croc-at-ease?

ML

[pianistimo]

oops.  platonic.  sorry.  croc-at-ease is what you're calling me now, eh.  well, michael_langlois - what would you call the pope?  or, perhaps i am mistaken and you are referring to the creator of the hydroponic sound system.

[mike_lang]

oops.  platonic.  sorry.  croc-at-ease is what you're calling me now, eh.  well, michael_langlois - what would you call the pope?  or, perhaps i am mistaken and you are referring to the creator of the hydroponic sound system.

hydropontic, perhaps?

Okay...I'm done.

[pianistimo]

wait.  i'm not done with you.  just realize two can play at this game.  although, i must admit i'm no good at paint ball.

as i see it - there has to be something to gain from a game.  in the 'game of life' - we have many various agendas.  to find a mate - to find a religion - to find happiness - to find fulfillment - to have enough money to pay bills, etc etc  ok - if you are honest you tell people what your game is.  even if it is serious to you.  like for me - to be a concert pianist.  i have only met one other person (my six year old) that believes this will happen in my lifetime.  so does she have a special place in my heart - of course!

i think games are played in every area of life whether we call them games or something else.  it's probably more that we are testing the waters.  'if i do this - what happens then?'  i suppose women more often than men  - test their man's love.  i don't know why.  i suppose this is by women more my age than younger - because we want to know if we are loved not just for body but for mind and companionship.  occasionally i get mad at my husband because i think he's just not talking and discussing things enough with me - but then - i see that men don't like to really talk about scholarship that much with women despite how much they say they want to see them get ahead.  it's more like - ironing is ok.  if men were women for one day -they'd see that life gets very boring if you are only doing housework and a job.  there has to be somekind of mental stimulation.  if you want a really great relationship - you have to do with a woman what women are supposed to do with their children.  ask a lot of 'why' and 'i wonder' questions and get their minds going.  nobody truly wants a 'dumb blond' do they?  *rhetorical question. 

[pianistimo]

on another note - does anyone recall here in us (or elsewhere) this woman that claims she can get women married in a matter of weeks with her 'formula' or something.  i have no idea what it is.  i often wondered since i switched the channel.  do they simply learn to cook?

now - if i were to guess the other part - it would be 'never disagree with a man openly.'  there is something intensely erotic about this to men.  i've never figured out why.  perhaps it's some chip implanted in their brain not to be disagreed with.  it's very hard to do.

and, of course, petting them like a cat all the time. 

if i were to write a book 'how to make a man into putty in your hands' - it would probably be to drop everything and act interested.  make him feel like his pants are on fire.  and, never argue.  sabotage can be performed later. 

*sidenote:  i'm still wondering (jackie kennedy over here - marilyn monroe over there) what was going on in kennedy's mind.  well - i suppose that truth be told - dumb blonds always seem to win.  nevermind having a decent conversation - just block his view from any other women.  and, always be the one sitting on the side with the best view to the sports channel. 

[ahinton]

as you've been so kind to alternately defend and attack - i shall now defend you alistair.  despite the fact you are still unmarried (the word 'still' typically reserved for mother's who want their children married) - you don't seem perturbed about it.  perhaps one of the responders in this thread was correct.  if you are happy with yourself - you don't see another person as necessarily 'completing you' as though you are a puzzle with many pieces missing.  if you can stand on your own and be comfortable with your own existence - then anyone can do anything and it doesn't really affect you.

Thank you for your defence (although I'm uncertain what it is that you are defending me against). I'm not sure which responder to this thread you are referring to here or what he/she may have said to give rise to your reference, but being happy with oneself and being unaffected by what anyone else may do are not at all synonymous; if I were the latter (which I am not), I would surely not also be the former...

for instance, if i wanted - i could play a game with alistair (*a very bad one since i'm married) and send him desperate pleas for a long-term plantonic relationship - of which i've thought tchaikovsky was most prudent to have.  and, that i would send him money every month - in return for tidbits of musical information such as he drops here on pianoforum.  but, i'm afraid alistair would be hurt by the fact that i might want to 'pay him' for his collective years of wisdom.  and, in fact - never say a word to me again.  thus - my game would have backfired.

Offers of cash are always treated seriously - I am a composer, after all! That said, I certainly do not expect to receive payment for things that I might just happen to come up with on this forum, for example, nor am I sure that I've all that much in the way of "collective years of wisdom" in any case; I'm also rather less than certain that the notion of a paid-for platonic relationship is not in some sense oxymoronic (and I realise from your next paragraph that you know what this means)....

now- the best game - as i see it - is to not even flirt.  i used to think flirting was harmless.  that is an oxymoron.  the moron part being that men never take flirting as anything but serious.  if you really want to get-it-on - get married.  that's my advice.  then, you can dress the part (or undress) and not suddenly say 'i don't think this is a good idea.'  people who do that should, imo - just have paid for a helium balloon and then let it go into the atmosphere for the experience of watching it fly away.

Who exactly are you "advising" here? It's not entirely clear...

Best,

Alistair

[pianistimo]

in contemplating any and all advice that i might seemingly give in response to questions about anything and everything - i have realized that it's always hopelessly outdated.  i mean, i went to doing some chores around the house and wondered to myself 'why did i use the example of kennedy with jackie and marilyn.  do any young people today really care what they did?  i mean - i suppose in the sense of being helpful one could say 'things never truly change as much as they appear to...'  - but then - how much help is that?  to say - that young people aren't thinking for themselves and have fallen prey to the idea that someone else will do all the work.  as i see it - men think having a girlfriend means a clean house or sex five times a day.  did that ever happen in history?  you have to look at history.  and just because someone cooks one good meal doesn't mean they'll do it again.  answers are always in history.  and, of course, for women - marrying a man doesn't mean you will finally love yourself anymore than the hopeless self-loathing you had before (as someone else pointed out).  just go down to the local mall and buy $500. worth of clothes. 

now, if you are looking for companionship and someone to talk to and do things with - i'd suggest finding someone with similar interests.  and perhaps, alistair - i read between the lines and see that you wouldn't consider what other people do (outside your own personal life) isn't unimportant.  i mean - if someone can hold a conversation about things that one is interested in - they are far liklier to have a deeper connection than sex and organ size. 

basically, as i see it - if you want the truth about relationships - don't go for the ads and the promotions.  just like a vacation for $50. - how about hidden charges?  you know - the woman or man that wants to put $500,000 of life insurance on you.  beware!

[ahinton]

as i see it

Oh - here comes God  again! )or actually not, this time, as it happens...)

men think having a girlfriend means a clean house or sex five times a day.

One or the other? Not both? Oh, stop it, Susan!

did that ever happen in history?  you have to look at history.  and just because someone cooks one good meal doesn't mean they'll do it again.  answers are always in history.  and, of course, for women - marrying a man doesn't mean you will finally love yourself anymore than the hopeless self-loathing you had before (as someone else pointed out).  just go down to the local mall and buy $500. worth of clothes.

Now who are you advising? In one moment it was about cleaning the house and multiple daily sexual practice yet, in "the twinkling of an eye", it suddenly transforms into something about cooking. Then self-loathing. Then clothes-buying. Susan - what exactly are you on about here?...

now, if you are looking for companionship and someone to talk to and do things with - i'd suggest finding someone with similar interests.  and perhaps, alistair - i read between the lines and see that you wouldn't consider what other people do (outside your own personal life) isn't unimportant.  i mean - if someone can hold a conversation about things that one is interested in - they are far liklier to have a deeper connection than sex and organ size. 

Again, who are you supposedly advising now?...

basically, as i see it - if you want the truth about relationships - don't go for the ads and the promotions.  just like a vacation for $50. - how about hidden charges?  you know - the woman or man that wants to put $500,000 of life insurance on you.  beware!

Er - excuse me? - ...

That oft-used phrase of yours "as I see it" is potentially (and quite often also actually) quite bothersome...

Best,

Alistair

[mike_lang]

That oft-used phrase of yours "as I see it" is potentially (and quite often also actually) quite bothersome...

In general, it seems to indicate that some sort of a paranoid quasi-conspiracy theory will follow...

[ahinton]

In general, it seems to indicate that some sort of a paranoid quasi-conspiracy theory will follow...

Maybe - and if you say so - but, to me, it has rather more often appeared to presage a quasi-religious rant of a certain protestant and possibly presbyterian Pennsylvanian pianistimised orientation...

Best,

Alistair

[mike_lang]

of a certain protestant and possibly presbyterian Pennsylvanian pianistimised orientation...

Alli(s)teration much?

[ahinton]

Alli(s)teration much?

Entirely intended, naturellement! - but sadly also true as written, it might seem, M. LangLangois...

Best,

Alexandre

[ahinton]

if i were to write a book 'how to make a man into putty in your hands' - it would probably be to drop everything and act interested.  make him feel like his pants are on fire.  and, never argue.  sabotage can be performed later.

If I understood what you are talking about here, I might be quite concerned about it. You seem to want to make out of a man some substance that used to be used to fill cracks (pardonnez-moi!) in the days before Polyfilla and yet at the same time to "drop everything", "act interested" and "make him feel like his pants are on fire"; I am accordingly trying to envisage a man whose trouser zip is plastered with putty with your hands around it while the remainder of that garment is in the process of bursting into flames and I'm not at all sure whether that is more absurd than dangerous or vice versa, but the prospect of "sabotage" being "performed later" - as though it would not have been so already - nevertheless seems quite beyond appalling...

Susan, I know that you have several children, but it seems from this and several other things that you have posted on this forum that nothing is quite so fertile as your imagination...

Best,

Alistair

[pianistimo]

i mean harmless sabotage.  things like subliminal manipulation when he's sleeping by whispering in his ear over and over - you want to buy me another diamond ring.  it's on sale at ____ for only $300. dollars. 

or - whatever it is that you want the guy to do the next day.  'fix the leaky faucet' might be mixed in with something that he naturally likes to do - to obtain the best results from this subliminal stuff.

i've really not met any women that have used sabotage in the worst possible way - although i've heard this usually happens right before a divorce.  perhaps that is the worst game that is played.  to suddenly hate the person so much that you want to take everything they have and then run over them five times. 

however, i did get a very strange kick out of 'war of the roses.'  must have been the chemistry of those two.  anyways - hanging from the chandalier together put them in the predicament of actually working out a few o ftheir problems. 

[ahinton]

i mean harmless sabotage.

Isn't that another oxymoron?

things like subliminal manipulation when he's sleeping by whispering in his ear over and over - you want to buy me another diamond ring.  it's on sale at ____ for only $300. dollars. 

or - whatever it is that you want the guy to do the next day.  'fix the leaky faucet' might be mixed in with something that he naturally likes to do - to obtain the best results from this subliminal stuff.

Well, that hardly constitutes sabotage, does it?! And if you can find someone to get you any kind of genuine diamond ring from a legitimate source for the price of a decent dinner for two in an British restaurant, it would hardly seem even to warrant "subliminal manipulation", to my mind...

i've really not met any women that have used sabotage in the worst possible way - although i've heard this usually happens right before a divorce.  perhaps that is the worst game that is played.  to suddenly hate the person so much that you want to take everything they have and then run over them five times.

Well, that's another matter, of course. That said, not all divorce proceedings are riddled with such animosity in any case.

Anyway, to return to the specifics of the thread topic, there is no evidence that the playing of mind games (which are the kind referred to here) is confined to women in any event; some of their mind games may be somewhat different to those played out by men, but the principles (or lack thereof) and motivations behind them is not so different at all.

Best,

Alistair

[matterintospirit]

poor JIH. Look what happens when a guy looks for some freindly advice on how to get layed. What's the world coming to?

[pita bread]

poor JIH. Look what happens when a guy looks for some freindly advice on how to get layed. What's the world coming to?

I know, seriously!

[matterintospirit]

I know, seriously!

ah, Pita, we speak a similar "language"!

[thalbergmad]

if anyone wants to try it - how about prayer? 

I did try it. I asked God to blow up your computer.

The prayer went unanswered.

Thal

[ahinton]

I did try it. I asked God to blow up your computer.

The prayer went unanswered.

Thal

Can you be sure of that? Maybe He heard your prayer but failed to blow up that computer...

Anyway, welcome back, O Thalisman of Pianostreet!

Best,

Alistair

[thalbergmad]

Can you be sure of that? Maybe He heard your prayer but failed to blow up that computer...

Maybe i was not specific enough.

I just prayed that God blow up the computer of the nutcase that posts religious crap on pianostreets.

Thal

[ahinton]

Maybe i was not specific enough.

I just prayed that God blow up the computer of the nutcase that posts religious crap on pianostreets.

Thal

But if He'd answered you AND carried out that action successfully, she'd only go out and buy another one, as surely you realise.

I just wish that our Sister Susan would ease up on all this stuff and spend more time practising the piano (not that I have the faintest idea what her playing is like, but you get my drift, presumably). We each find her religious ramblings for the most part incoherent and I think that we each find that very incoherence at least as irritating as any other aspects of these expressions; you are exceedingly rude to hear as a result and I try to be firm and honest without actually being rude, but either way I still wish, for her own sake (never mind everyone else's here), that she'd keep all this to herself most of the time and get on with something useful. Are you listening, Susan?

A r e   y o u   l i s t e n i n g,   S u s a n? . . .

And now back to games played by women that do not involve Protestant Christian evangelising...

Best,

Alistair

[electrodoc]

It took me many years to learn a few simple things:

Always show a woman respect, even when she is playing games, being in a mood, etc. A woman has different hormones to a man and these govern her emotions in a different way. It is simply part of being female.

If you like someone then show it! Talk to them, be pleasant. Let her know that you like her and would like to develop a friendship.

Don't be too anxious to rush into sex. If the relationship is good and right it will develop. If it is not a good relationship then better not to play with the emotions - yours or hers.

If you love her then tell her. Let her know that you really do care for her. Ok, so you might get rejected a few times. So what? I am sure that you are strong enough to cope with it.

We live in a troubled world. One filled with suspicion, mistrust, greed, and too much hatred. Why not start trying to like each other and respect each other? The above suggestions would be good if we learned to apply them to all relationships regardless of "him or her".

As far a Susan's religious beliefs go, I may or may not agree with her but I will defend her right to speak about her beliefs. This is called freedom of expression and we have fought wars to defend this principle.

Regards

Electrodoc

[ahinton]

As far a Susan's religious beliefs go, I may or may not agree with her but I will defend her right to speak about her beliefs. This is called freedom of expression and we have fought wars to defend this principle.

I'll defend it, too; what is far less defensible is her insistence upon dragging them into exchanges where they are not relevant and when they have not been sought by any other participant in those exchanges. Freedom of expression is one thing; dogged obsession with just one aspect of it is quite another.

Anyway, following the question in my most recent post in this thread, it would appear that Susan is NOT listening...

Best,

Alistair