Chopin's 24 Études (Realization by Guy Bacos with new approach)

[guy5]

Realization by Guy Bacos of  Chopin 24 Études

These Études have been enhanced artistically, through digital process, to bring out more features.  Various kinds of manipulations have been done, such as tweaking dynamics, speed, accents, notes etc. 

Op. 10 No. 1 (Waterfall)
Op. 10 No. 2 (Chromatic)
Op. 10 No. 3 (Tristesse)
Op. 10 No. 4 (Torrent)
Op. 10 No. 5 (Black Key)
Op. 10 No. 6
Op. 10 No. 7 (Toccata)
Op. 10 No. 8 (Sunshine)
Op. 10 No. 9
Op. 10 No. 10
Op. 10 No. 11 (Arpeggio)
Op. 10 No. 12 (Revolutionary)

Op 25 No. 1 (Aeolian Harp)
Op 25 No. 2 (The Bees)
Op 25 No. 3 (The Horseman)
Op 25 No 4 (Paganini)
Op 25 No. 5 (Wrong Note)
Op 25 No. 6 (Double Third)
Op 25 No. 7 (Cello)
Op 25 No. 8 (Sixths)
Op 25 No. 9 (Butterfly)
Op 25 No. 10 (Octave)
Op 25 No. 11 (Winter Wind)
Op 25 No. 12 (Ocean)

I hope you enjoy listening and I look forward to your comments.

Guy Bacos
https://www.guybacos.com/

[pianoplayjl]

This is one of the last things I expected to be recorded: a complete set of the etudes by one member/pianist. I listened to the first and second etudes. I can only say that it is very amazing and the best I've heard since Polini. There were some parts I thought didn't sound right but in the end it was your interpretation and it was outstanding. I'll listen to the others in my own time.

BTW the audio quality was really excellent. What piano did you play on? Steinway?

JL

[arturfan]

 You're kidding, right?  This is the most obvious set of bogus digital recordings I've ever heard.

[starstruck5]

I have listened to the first five so far. I have to say the playing is quite impressive.  It would be nice to have video instead of audio -because it seems you have been accused of hornswoggling -(ie deceit) which is a bit unfair without any proof to the contrary -

Anyway, congratulations on mastering this difficult repetoire!

[unholeee]

i found that, if that helps =))

[guy5]

Sorry didn't get a chance to adjust the title, which is done now. it's more of a realization. I am a good pianist and CAN play all 24 Études live and have most of them, But for this project I wanted to get the most out of them and this included using digital enhancement. Didn't mean to mislead anyone, but hope you can still appreciate the work done here. Thanks for the comments!

Guy

[ronde_des_sylphes]

i found that, if that helps =))

{EDIT: typed before I was aware of the original poster's clarification}

Yes, it is interesting. Suggests that he's played the pieces, got the keyboard to record the input and then manipulated the resultant midi. (For example, the tempo is clearly slower in that recording than the version posted here.) Fair enough I guess in the sense that conventional studio recordings are also liable to manipulation in a variety of ways. Whether it counts as a "performance of the Chopin 24 Études just recently recorded" is a matter for debate; in the conventional sense it clearly doesn't, but I don't think that automatically disqualifies the recordings from having merit.

I don't like the interpretation of op.10 no.3 though. (Of the samples which I listened to, I thought that the faster, more con brio sections worked better than the slower pieces where I felt the colouristic limitations of this approach were more apparent and there were also some, on first listening, what appeared to be odd tempo surges.)

[perfect_pitch]

I am a good pianist and CAN play all 24 Études

But did you physically play the etudes for these recordings?

[guy5]

But did you physically play the etudes for these recordings?

Oh yes!  It's not like if it was done with the mouse from A to Z, the expression had to be there right from the initial recording. After that I worked on enhancing certain things. I can play them all at that speed, but wouldn't sound as good and would be mistakes here and there. But the main goal here was to to make Vienna Imperial Updated sound good, I thought it would be a good idea to do this through Chopin 24 Études, and if I can make them shine, I will feel I have accomplished the goal. Feel free for more clarification.

[guy5]

This might help:

https://www.vsl.co.at/en/65/71/2035/1731.vsl

[pianoplayjl]

You're kidding, right?  This is the most obvious set of bogus digital recordings I've ever heard.

He ain't kidding and I doubt you could have played half as well, unless you post your stuff here. Guy must be given credit just for learning the whole set which would have taken most people at least half a lifetime to play to a reasonable standard. Even before he digitally enhanced the recordings I still think they are very good. Good that you digitally enhanced it, anyway IMO.

I am a good pianist and CAN play all 24 Études

That part I can agree with. I appreciate your effort.

JL

[birba]

Not to change the subject, but I hope a good pianist might NOT be able to play all the chopin etudes...

[troglodyte]

Guy also posted this on Piano World and on Piano Society. In both cases the threads got so nasty that the moderators locked it. Hope this will not happen here.

[birba]

Why?!

[troglodyte]

PSociety is fundamentalist against manipulated recordings and the admins run a tight ship. At PW you get all kinds but some were offended at what they conceived as deception, hard words were exchanged while the moderator was away and it got out of hand. The threads are still there for those who think such are entertaining. I am sad that this draws attention from Guy's considerable achievement. OK, he did get lots of attention, but not the kind he deserved.

[guy5]

It's beyond my understanding as well. My initial goal was to test it on people, and after a few comments see if it would come out as credible high caliber interpretations. if I say right from the start it's been digitally enhanced, there is a strong uproar reaction by the purist and "elitist", this is something I wanted to avoid so I could get an honest reaction. My intention was to soon after say it was done on Vienna Imperial Updated https://www.vsl.co.at/en/65/71/2035/1731.vsl besides how can I keep this a secret very long when I'm using my real name and with this publicity. But there was a very bad reaction when people new it had modern technology involved, i came out the next day and explain exactly how I proceed it, was honest about the whole thing. I'm mainly talking about PianoWorld. People came like a pack of wolves repeating time after time they had been misled, they just refused to understand my initial intention here, all they were obsessed was how they were misled. Once it was talked about that it was digitally enhanced, there was constant bashing about this. To begin, they spent about 20 posts talking about how stupid it was to have put these titles associated with the Études. This was so insignificant for me, the idea came from a friend and I just went along with it, it was the first time i ever used these pseudonym, but who cares! Then it just kept going on and on how I was an impostor saying these interpretations aren't mine, and this and that. Fine I don't mind saying they are realization or use another word even though some serious interpretation skills are involved here. There was some who then said, "Oh I just listened to a few bars of the first one and stopped..."  Others saying: "Guy it is clear you have failed in your attempt to... "   It made an incredible controversy and although slowed down, still going on.  If you can afford a $200,000. grand with pro sound engineers, that's the best result you'll get. But am alternative is to use the tool I was presenting, but to prove it was effective I first wanted to show it as an interpretation. People felt VERY offended by that, despite it was only going to be until I get some comments.  I'm not sure what is their feeling behind this. Did they feel threaten by these recordings? I just wanted to do my job for this project, which I think I did. I really didn't want to start WW3 with this. Well anyway, I'm happy to see that on Pianostreet it's going smoothly and with the exception of one comment, I like how it's going, I may hang around this forum.  I'm actually not proud of having to justify all this, but if I don't, people may go with what they here from Pianoworld. Anyway, hope you keep enjoying these Études. And I'm no Pollini, just an average good pianist, and with no pretense that these interpretation are fully mine, in the traditional sense.

[gn622]

I'm confused, how was this digitally enhanced?

[troglodyte]

Guy, you are going to get lots of questions like from gn622, might as well give an account of it on your website and post a link - or be prepared to explain this many times!

The reaction at PSociety didn't really surprise me since I know them to be fundamentalist in this respect. That's the way they want it and it is their site, which in many respects is very good. Had you known it you would probably have skipped that site. But PW really surprised me.

I understand and respect why you did as you did. But I think there is a lesson to be learned in psychology here. Some people started to get suspicious and googled you before you gave the full explanation, and then they lost trust and nothing you said really registered any more. That's just how some people work. I understand that you initially wanted an unbiased reaction, but if you post at a place of piano enthusiasts someone is bound to find out quickly anyway, and then you get both the bias _and_ the mistrust. For that reason I feel it might have been better to give the full explanation in the initial post.

Having said that I hope you appreciate the many positive comments you got on PW.

To continue our discussion from PW I'd like to know: when you do the edits, do you feel or fear that there is a tradeoff between musicality and perfection? I am not talking about correcting mistakes here but for example, if there is a slightly uneven run and you correct it to be absolutely even, do you also lose something? Cannot small imperfections due to physical limitations in some sense be part of the interpretation, and even foreseen by the composer? While this comes naturally when playing I imagine it to be quite difficult to take into account in the editing.

[guy5]

You said to continue our discussion on PW, we're you in the thread over there? Just so many new names, lost track...

[troglodyte]

Yes, with the same nickname - I imagine you do not want to go back there. I tried to chip in some serious questions about the procedure but they were mainly drowned by the flame wars.

[cbreemer]

The reaction at PSociety didn't really surprise me since I know them to be fundamentalist in this respect. That's the way they want it and it is their site, which in many respects is very good. Had you known it you would probably have skipped that site.

Fundamentalist, that sounds dangerous   But I guess you could put it like that.

Guy could have known, he'd been here before. While he was merely hurt and a little bitter about our dismissal on general principles, and our suspicion about whether he'd actually played these, the discussion turned nasty only when two of his close friends suddenly registered and jumped the gun to defend him. One of these was banned right away on account of his puerile and insulting rant. With friends like that, who needs enemies ! When Guy declared he had nothing more to say on the subject ( unlike on PW  ) I thought it best to lock the thread and be done with it. Pity as we could maybe have had a nice long shouting match too

[guy5]

I'm trying to have a peaceful thread here and so far it's going very well. Please Piano Society people, I'm asking you nicely to not interfere. I didn't even mention anything about your forum. I'm happy here and I love this forum. Thank you!

[guy5]

I'll add that a few days ago I had sent a message to Piano Society, and this, after they had locked the thread, I asked one of the mods if I could change the title to "my realization" instead of "my interpretation", but couldn't because it was locked. I thought it would fix things for the future, and show good intentions on my part. They chose to not respond to me and leave it as it is, which I didn't appreciate.

[quantum]

I find this approach quite fascinating!  Could you enlighten us a bit more on it?  I have listened to a few selections and am intrigued.  There are some very good research questions that can be sought here.  While some of the purist may be crying blasphemy, musicians and musicologists studying the recording arts and the hybridity of technology and human performance may be interested in your work.  Your negative encounters on other forms may be a case of wrong audience.  

I wonder what the purists would think of their heroes - the great pianists - and what they did in the editing studio.  

As others have pointed out earlier, the presentation of deceptive statements or what is perceived to be deceptive actions, can derail a situation in short time.  There have been some highly publicized deceptions in recorded classical music, so I cannot blame people of being weary of similar cases.  It is probably best to state the details of your project upfront. If you wished to survey opinions it is also best to state that fact upfront to your informants, with the knowledge that you seek their "blind" opinion of the music.  

[guy5]

Of course, knowing what I know now, I would of approached it differently. For me I don't think it would of bothered me, but since we are all different...  but what's done is done.

[johnlewisgrant]

I have been a member of PS, Piano World, and Piano Street for many years, and this issue--exactly this issue--has come up many times.

The issues are actually not all that complicated: the root problem (if it may be called that) is that piano sampling, audio editing, and midi are now so sophisticated that it is impossible to be sure what is a live performance and what is partly or wholly doctored, edited, or transformed electronically.  

A friend of mine recently performed a Chopin Nocturne for me at my piano, recorded it with a Nikon D7000, and then substituted a midi-sculpted audio file for the original recorded performance at my wife's MAC.

I have played piano every day now (strictly classical I have to admit) for over 50 years: I could not discern ANY subterfuge in the final product:  I was astonished.  Shocked.  Stunned.  Gob-smacked.  

So the implications are very plain:  unless you know the pianist personally, or you have seen him or her perform, etc., etc.. there is no way on God's good earth to know whether or not something is "real" or "slightly edited" or "super-edited"!!!  

Guy's submissions were, for various reasons, transparently midi-edited and employed a sampled piano.  This is exactly what I do... I have NO problem with it.

But I completely understand the main issue that it raises: many, perhaps all, piano sites invite submissions as a forum for analyzing and discussing piano technique.  That sort of activity is... well... "undermined" where submssions have been altered (whether through midi or audio-editing).  Because that is a quite different sort of technique.   Piano technique in the traditional sense is only one part of midi and audio editing.  It is clear that much of what is done in the edit process is designed, in fact, to overcome technical shortcomings.   Hence the notion that it is a "cheat"!!!

Problem is how do you sort out slightly edited from completely fabricated?  In other words: enforcement of a rule... any rule... to sort out the different kinds of piano material submitted.

Guy's rendition of the Etudes (both sets!!!) was submitted without the usual sort of clarification about process of creation, and I guess some folks were a little embarrassed that they didn't spot the sampled piano, or the midi-editing right from the get go.   Sort of a "Joyce Hatto" moment!

Others just think it's wrong to post stuff that isn't performed live.

Others, which include me, are interested mainly in the beauty of the final result (like a beautiful piece of driftwood), and secondarily concerned with the question of how the result was achieved.

But it's all OK in my books.  

Live performances are fine.  Edited performances are fine.  Midi-creations are fine.  (At least for me personally.)   But I can completely appreciate the reasoning of those who want prompt and accurate disclosure re which category!!!  

Point is: it will have to be an honour system, because there's no forensic science that will provide an easy answer.  

Not any more...  Technology is too advanced.

JG

[ajspiano]

maybe its been said and I missed it, but I would like to know what exactly you did to digitally enhance the recordings.

I have the facility to do this kind of thing with pianoteq/protools, but its not something I've experimented with since I just like playing and learning how to play better.

Using midi (protools) I can obviously adjust numerous factors, most specifically I can 'fix' wrong notes, adjust the timing of certain notes and adjust the velocity of certain notes.

With pianoteq I can alter how the piano patch receives the input..  so I have quite a meriad of tools should I want to make a professional recording.. ..I think I would be telling people if I'd done that though, I hold no value on complements if I didnt actually perform the task live. Thats just me though. I certainly appreciate the skills involved in electronic production.

[guy5]

Thanks for your post JG, and clarifications!

One thing I must mention, I am not a regular user on Piano Society, I was there the first time a few years ago to present a composition for 2 pianos, "Bagatelle", then around Christmas time to present "Christmas Chimes" for 2 pianos, and now with these Études. So basically 3 times including reading the replies of what I had posted. I was not aware about this rule. How often do we read all the rules of a forum? I wish I had known.

[johnlewisgrant]

Thanks for your post JG, and clarifications!

One thing I must mention, I am not a regular user on Piano Society, I was there the first time a few years ago to present a composition for 2 pianos, "Bagatelle", then around Christmas time to present "Christmas Chimes" for 2 pianos, and now with these Études. So basically 3 times including reading the replies of what I had posted. I was not aware about this rule. How often do we read all the rules of a forum? I wish I had known.

As noted above in this thread, PS is pretty conservative.  But they do in fact accept midi-edited stuff and sampled pianos.   They are, I guess, very strict about disclosure.  That position on disclosure was, curiously, in large part because of my WTC 1, which was all the rage about 8? years ago.  I was mentioned in the Manchester Guardian, but noting that the work was at a sampled piano and midi-edited.  If you read my  bio at PS its all laid out, now, as a result of a debate identical to the ones that are happening at Piano World.  

When PS was starting up, I was asked out of the blue (I had no idea who they were) if they could put the WTC1 up at their site.  They didn't know that it was edited and indeed that it was a sampled BOS.   The issue came up at PS, a number of editors resigned over it, ie refused to be associated with ps as long as my stuff was up there.  I apologized for the misunderstanding AND said I would be happy to remove all of it!  But the folks who ended up running the site said they wanted to keep it.   Hence the evolution of rules about timely and frank disclosure.  But now it is possible to completely "fake" audio AND video performances, and I mean utterly convincingly.  (Even I can't tell... and I used to think I was pretty good.)  So I sometimes wonder whether, in practice, the rules make much difference.

So I totally understand, appreciate and respect the purist line, while also respecting the beauty that can be inherent in an art product, irrespective of the process that brought it into being.   I am in fact, without too much research at this point, initially impressed by this particular sampled piano.  But as most folks know, I'm very hard on all sampled midi stuff (my own included, which I don't like much).  And I'm particularly hard (do I mean discerning?) about the quality of sampled pianos.

JG

[maxtrainfla]

Does everyone here realize that Guy works for and is compensated by VSL for promoting their products here? Just thought you should know that this is all one big advertisment for Guy's sponsors.

[johnlewisgrant]

Does everyone here realize that Guy works for and is compensated by VSL for promoting their products here? Just thought you should know that this is all one big advertisment for Guy's sponsors.

Who knows?  This sort of thing may happen more often than we imagine!  If it is the case, it is a matter for the folks at PianoStreet to sort out. 

I suppose Guy could say whether his purposes are purely educational, or whether there is money or compensation or consideration of some other kind for his midi work.

[maxtrainfla]

.

[johnlewisgrant]

You're kidding, right?  This is the most obvious set of bogus digital recordings I've ever heard.

Midi-edited, no doubt.  I don't find that, in itself objectionable, although I do think it means that the work should be held to a VERY high standard.  I'm only just beginning to listen to them.  Op. 25 No. 8 is, I'm just being frank, BAD midi.  I don't know whether or not it was "performed" first and then edited, but it doesn't matter, because the end-product sounds like one of the original quantized midi files, painfully metronomic, with utterly fake rubato effects.  It is partly saved by the sampled-piano itself, which seems to have possibilities.  But, otherwise, very hard indeed on the old ears!

[guy5]

I have mentioned on PianoWorld that I found PianoStreet.com much more interesting and would stop posting on PianoWorld. I would expect people who have nothing better to do to come here and make trouble for me. This comment came from a newbe: maxtrainfla, his 3rd post in total, he obviously made an effort to come here and mention this to make me look bad. Some people from PianoWorld are just frustrated that I chose this forum for future discussions.

Anyway, people who know me and have followed me over the years, and you could see my FB page if you want, feel free to friend me, and see details on my wall, I have always posted EVERYTHING I have done for VSL, in many forums and my FB wall. I rarely make mention of VSL, and the reason is, I am foremost a composer, and I want to present what I do on an artistic level independently of VSL, see my website: https://www.guybacos.com/  I want to present myself as a composer first. If it makes the product looks good, which I seem to do well, then I'm twice as happy. VSL makes IT'S OWN advertisement, and they don't care if I post my music on any forum, they let me do what I want with my music, it doesn't change a single thing with the compensation I get from them. Most people who follow me, knows this very well, they know I want to show my composition and get feedback. It seems that many of the people on PianoWorld, think I came from nowhere and have a scheme with these Études. All I have to say to them is, do your homework first!

It is sad that I'm spending all my time in the last few days being bashed here and there, I don't think I deserve this. So now that PianoWorld and PianoSociety knows I am happier here, you could see they want to interfere and out doubts in peoples mind.

[guy5]

He may claim it's educational but that would be a big stretch... more like infomercial.

I claimed it was educational for ME, and it was VERY educational for me. Thanks maxtrainfla, glad you brought up that point!

[pianoplayjl]

Hey, Guy5, I'm a very big fan of ur recordings of the Chopin etudes. If you say that you edited the etudes a bit to clean up the mess, why don't you post just  1 actual video of yourself playing  a Chopin etude to clarify things a little and convince the skeptics how good you are even without the Editing.

JL

[guy5]

There are some videos on VSL of me playing live, although we don't see my face, so... what can i say? Anyway, I have added a text explaining more things on the first post. Hope that will calm some people down.

[maxtrainfla]

.

[maxtrainfla]

I am a good pianist and CAN play all these Études live and have, but for the purpose of demonstrating Vienna Imperial Updated I wanted to make these Étude shine more.

If you are really interested in full disclosure, why not add the following to your OP:

"I am also being compensated for promoting these samples in this forum by the
Vienna Library"

[bustthewave]

First off, I enjoyed these greatly!

Secondly... wow... all the crazy drama is crazy (as it's been described on the other forums, not here).

It sounds like people are assuming that digitally altered/enhanced pieces automatically assume fake. Don't people realize that ANY CD they go and purchase of ANY recorded performance, be it live or studio, is heavily digitally altered?

It's all post production, and a definite art form in and of itself. This can and usually does include note modulation, added reverb, dynamic modulation... This goes for live symphony recordings to piano performances, to lady gaga. It's just the nature of the music industry, and doesn't lesson the ability of the performer.

The only way I could see this at all being negative in this case, is if Guy indicated he had performed them exactly as they sound. This is misleading to the performance abilities, but Guy has been way more transparent on this than he owed us.

So on a mixing and editing level, you did a brilliant job. Many aspects of this were PERFECTLY handled, including dynamics, tonal control, and tempo. Reverb is present, but not overpowering by any means. It's too bad you can't get feedback for your interpretation because of the nature of the project... mixing forums typically know very little about classical music or musical interpretation (if you know of any that break the norm please share! ).

Aside from that, sorry for your experiences from people who don't quite understand what mixing, mastering, and sound production actually entails, and how much they listen to it every day without realizing it.

Just something to ponder though - is it really all that different than a concert pianist recording the same song 50 times to get the version that didn't have any mistakes?

[pianoplayjl]

If you are really interested in full disclosure, why not add the following to your OP:

"I am also being compensated for promoting these samples in this forum by the
Vienna Library"

I am just here to warn everyone that you are, in fact, a shill for a commerical sample library and you are only posting here now to promote their products.

Maybe you should go to work for Hormel. They have your kind of products there: SPAM and BACONBITS!   

Not to be mean,  butI think we are going a bit off topic lets not forget that we are in the audition room and it's purpose is to judge and hear other member'srecordings, not discuss the validity of other member's recordings. I seem to recall a bit the topic unedited, said to listen to the recordings and say whether  you like it or not and then give some feedback. You can judge and say what is nice and what you don't like about the interpretation, music wise. And let's not make this flame war escalate.

JL

[guy5]

First off, I enjoyed these greatly!

Secondly... wow... all the crazy drama is crazy (as it's been described on the other forums, not here).

It sounds like people are assuming that digitally altered/enhanced pieces automatically assume fake. Don't people realize that ANY CD they go and purchase of ANY recorded performance, be it live or studio, is heavily digitally altered?

It's all post production, and a definite art form in and of itself. This can and usually does include note modulation, added reverb, dynamic modulation... This goes for live symphony recordings to piano performances, to lady gaga. It's just the nature of the music industry, and doesn't lesson the ability of the performer.

The only way I could see this at all being negative in this case, is if Guy indicated he had performed them exactly as they sound. This is misleading to the performance abilities, but Guy has been way more transparent on this than he owed us.

So on a mixing and editing level, you did a brilliant job. Many aspects of this were PERFECTLY handled, including dynamics, tonal control, and tempo. Reverb is present, but not overpowering by any means. It's too bad you can't get feedback for your interpretation because of the nature of the project... mixing forums typically know very little about classical music or musical interpretation (if you know of any that break the norm please share! ).

Aside from that, sorry for your experiences from people who don't quite understand what mixing, mastering, and sound production actually entails, and how much they listen to it every day without realizing it.

Just something to ponder though - is it really all that different than a concert pianist recording the same song 50 times to get the version that didn't have any mistakes?

Well said!

[maxtrainfla]

.

[pianoplayjl]

He isn't spamming! We'll see in the next few days what happens to this thread. If it is somehow deleted or modified by admin then we'll say that Guy is spamming. If nothing happens then he obviously isn't spamming, merely trying to share his piano playing.

Guy, I don't know your intentions posting the 24 Chopin etudes edited, but if you are just trying to share your wonderful playing ability and get some feedback, then I really appreciate you doing that.

JL

[ajspiano]

The piece is 10 min but I couldn't make it available in its complete version since it is sold on online stores, so I did a condensed 4 min version of it, enough to give an idea.

"Christmas Chimes"

https://www.guybacos.com/audio/Christmas%20Chimes%20Samples.mp3

Thanks!

Guy Bacos
https://www.cdbaby.com/Artist/GuyBacos
https://www.guybacos.com/

This is from his first post..   certainly strikes me as spammmm.

Placing all 24 etudes in a single thread here also strikes me as being someone not looking for advice on their playing/interpretation but rather trying to grab our attention.

I'm not that bothered one way or another though, and have enjoyed listening to the etudes..

[gvans]

Having done a fair amount of midi in my song-writing days, and Photo-Shopping in my photog days, I would like to state the following: you can't shine s#$t. And Guy Bacos, to have produced these realizations, started with some damn good piano playing. OK, he edited out clams, did some tweaking here and there, and yes, he's got mega-experience in midi from his movie work. Yeah, he's a pro, and like most of us at some times in our lives (except for those trust fund babies), trying to make a buck.

To discount his mastery of the medium would be, however, unwise. These are amazing renditions, artfully done. I listened to Op. 10, #3, the etude in thirds, and Winter Wind. Astounding.

Would it be, though, as someone else suggested, too much to offer us up a rough, un-tweaked, recorded cut? We'd all like to know exactly how much manipulation was done. This would settle some of the drama, I think...

How about letting us hear the original etude in thirds? Exactly how fast did you play it on the rough take, Guy? Just curious. I'll register a quibble that the realization is too speedy. One can't truly appreciate the melodic left hand. IMHO. Chopin made a point of complaining that many virtuosi played some of his works too fast...

[maxtrainfla]

.

[johnlewisgrant]

Here's the deal:

It's all well and good to say, "I performed them myself, really I did!"   And "How dare you call my integrity into question, I got a video of my hands playing for one of them!"  

Fact is: tons of realtime midi Etude performances are already available on the Net.   And one video of a pair of hands playing a keyboard does not convincing evidence make that person x or y working for VSL did not simply manipulate what's already out there and easy to access, to showcase the sample!

So......absent video evidence, folks are just saying or thinking: lay off the "I did 'em all myself" claim, and just concentrate on the "I did a great job putting various pre-existing midi files into a convincing sampled piano format for VSL incorporated" claim.  

Then we could get on with the important business of determining whether the VSL Bos is worth 700 bucks.


JG

PS My initial impressions of the sample are positive... but like so many others at other forums we all inhabit, we're starting to feel a weeeee bit manipulated!

[jazzyprof]

It's fine if you like the music that Guy's computer makes (I think it sounds pretty cool too), but just know he is not here to get feedback on his playing or be a part of the community.

He's ONLY here to promote his product.

Dude, who appointed you to guard the virginity of this forum?  You're now spamming us with your silly and obnoxious rants.  You've had your say, many times.  Now go chill so people with an interest in the subject can discuss the important question of technologically enhanced performance.

[maxtrainfla]

.)