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Topic: Camera recording stuff  (Read 3320 times)

Offline throwawaynotreally

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Camera recording stuff
on: June 21, 2014, 10:53:28 AM
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Offline Bob

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #1 on: June 21, 2014, 01:48:17 PM
Haha...  Sounds like the right side?

There are some other posts about specific recording equipment and software on here.  I think it's quantum I'm thinking of... I think he was recording video and audio separately and then putting them together/editing later.

See what you think of Youtube videos.  You'll pick up what not to do from there. 


If it's just one camera and you're not moving it, there's one spot where that would go.

There would be one spot for the mic (if it's one mic).  Maybe over the strings.  Beyond the lid.  Where the audience would sit.  It depends how it sounds.

You'd have to experiment to figure out what you like best. 

Sounds like you might need something better to record audio.  (And then possibly a better camera, depending on what you've got, better computer for editing, etc.  Always possible to get more and more....)   It's wise to keep all the equipment on the same quality level though.  The crappiest piece in the system can determine the overall quality. 
Favorite new teacher quote -- "You found the only possible wrong answer."

Offline throwawaynotreally

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #2 on: June 21, 2014, 02:29:54 PM
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Offline flashyfingers

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #3 on: June 22, 2014, 02:20:44 AM
I like to put the camera at the back, about 5 feet away. At this length, the camera should be about shoulder height (shoulder height when sitting on the piano bench). The further it is, then it should be a little higher. Sound rises from the floor up, it prefers space rather than floor and walls.

  :)

Also, the camera directly behind your back is pretty weird, so maybe keep it less centered and more over your left or right shoulder.
I'm hungry

Online quantum

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #4 on: June 22, 2014, 03:41:21 AM
If you can run Audacity and you can clap your hands, you can sync properly.  No fancy equipment required.  If you want to get creative, you can make a DIY clapper board.  
https://audacity.sourceforge.net/
https://www.ehow.com/how_5140030_make-own-clapper-board.html

Separating the camera and mic goes a long way to making a good sounding music vid.  You don't need expensive gear to do this, just a camera and a mic that records independent of the camera.  You can also have someone handle the camera while you play, and the separated mic won't pick up handling noise.  

For music vids, I'd say the quality of the audio is more important than that of the video.  


Made a Liszt. Need new Handel's for Soler panel & Alkan foil. Will Faure Stein on the way to pick up Mendels' sohn. Josquin get Wolfgangs Schu with Clara. Gone Chopin, I'll be Bach

Offline throwawaynotreally

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #5 on: June 22, 2014, 09:28:30 AM
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Offline throwawaynotreally

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #6 on: June 22, 2014, 09:32:12 AM
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Offline throwawaynotreally

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #7 on: June 22, 2014, 09:43:38 AM
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Offline throwawaynotreally

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #8 on: June 22, 2014, 09:45:30 AM
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Online quantum

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #9 on: June 24, 2014, 04:27:30 AM
I've worked with Audacity before, but my present computer does not have a jack for an external microphone, and the built-in one is quite bad.
Did you mean recording the audio and video at the same time? That is a good idea, I think I'll do that once I find a way to record the audio with a microphone.
Thank you very much again, your advice is really helpful :D

Yes, audio and video at the same time.  

For starters, you could get one of those portable audio recorders.  They are inexpensive and have decent quality.  Because of their small size, you can easily pack one when traveling to a performance venue or even the practice room at school.  Zoom H4 and Edirol R09 are two examples. 

Made a Liszt. Need new Handel's for Soler panel & Alkan foil. Will Faure Stein on the way to pick up Mendels' sohn. Josquin get Wolfgangs Schu with Clara. Gone Chopin, I'll be Bach

Online quantum

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #10 on: June 24, 2014, 05:05:28 AM
Dynamic mics (and other karaoke related gear) are terrible for piano, they are much better suited for other sound sources such as voice.  Try it out yourself, grab an SM 58 (they are available everywhere) and try to record a piano with it.

Condensers are much better for piano.  You can find some budget condensers at the $100 level that do a pretty good job for what they cost.  Move up to the $500 mics, and you can get some really good sound.  There are many threads on mics on Pianostreet, look around.  It is more about mic technique than how much money you can spend on gear.  If you are going to invest in mics, read up on stereo mic technique.

This recent thread has a good discussion on mics.
https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php?topic=55288.0

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For video editing try:

Virtualdub:
https://www.virtualdub.org/

Avidemux
https://fixounet.free.fr/avidemux/screenshots.html

Blender.  It is geared more for 3d graphics, but some people use it for video.
https://www.blender.org/

Lightworks.  It's a pro NLE that has a free version.  Supposed to be open source (or that was the plan).
https://www.lwks.com/
Made a Liszt. Need new Handel's for Soler panel & Alkan foil. Will Faure Stein on the way to pick up Mendels' sohn. Josquin get Wolfgangs Schu with Clara. Gone Chopin, I'll be Bach

Offline richard black

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #11 on: July 10, 2014, 09:32:39 PM
Most cameras (DSLR or video) will tend to get filthy sound when recording live music because they have Automatic Level Control (ALC), also known as Automatic Gain Control (AGC), which boosts quiet bits and cuts (and/or distorts) loud bits. If you can turn that off via a menu command you have some chance of getting a decent recording - at least, you'll be able to find out if the microphone(s) built in are any good. An external microphone plugged into the camera will not automatically avoid the ALC. The way forward is either a high-end camera with proper sound track capabilities, plus an external microphone, or as suggested above, a separate audio recorder. I go for the latter solution and use Serif MoviePlus software (not free, but very cheap) to marry the two up on the PC.
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Offline throwawaynotreally

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #12 on: July 11, 2014, 02:00:29 PM
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Offline visitor

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #13 on: July 11, 2014, 04:54:09 PM
i like all in ones, i.e. HD video on board with good solid microphones, makes for ease of use and less hassle w equipment and such.

I have a good one that I like that isn't made any longer, but sony makes a pretty good one, cheap too

https://store.sony.com/music-video-recorder-zid27-HDRMV1/cat-27-catid-Music-Video-Recorders?_t=pfm%3Dcategory

Offline outin

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #14 on: July 12, 2014, 08:09:46 AM
I have problems getting decent recordings (playing aside) with my recorders. I have Olympus LS-5 (audio only) and Olympus LS-20M (audio+video). I still get better sound form my small Digital Ixus video camera, but it's not very handy to use. It doesn't really make sense...

I have tried to find the right mic settings and tried different positions. With audio if I put the devide very far away to the other side of the room and use very low rec level it's not so bad, but not really good either.

With the video recorder I cannot do that, there simply isn't that much room if I want to see my hands... If I use the low mic sense the bass sounds like it's coming from a toomb. If I use the high mic sense the upper parts start breaking. I did drop the device in the cats' water bowl once  :-[, which did damage the inbuilt speaker (there's some hissing) but I don't think the mics were affected...it sounds fine when I record singing...I think...

Is it really so difficult to record the piano sound or is it just my piano (a loud upright) or the poor room acoustics? What would normally be a good place for the mics?

I really don't want to do any editing, just to hear how I sound I real life as much as possible...

Offline iancollett6

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #15 on: July 12, 2014, 09:22:27 AM
Hi,
   I just bought a little device called iRig Pro by a company called IKMultimedia.
 Its a little unit which contains a 9V battery, this is for the phantom power. It has an XLR input which I plug a condensor Mic into. The other side plugs into an IPhone, Ipad etc.
 There are a heap of apps that you can use it with but I only use it with the Iphone Video Camera.
 It cost me about $220 Australian Dollars, so probably cheaper anywhere else in the world!!
 I love it!
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Online quantum

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #16 on: July 12, 2014, 12:45:18 PM
As is often the case, the optimal position for video camera and mics are not at the same place.  All-in-one video/mic recorders are convenient for practice sessions or casual Youtube vids. However, when one wants to improve upon the sound the video and mics need to be separated.  One needs to balance convenience with quality.   

First thing to check is that the mic auto gain is turned off (as mentioned earlier).  Next you would do a recording level test to make sure the loudest sounds you are making are not clipping.  Manually adjust the gain to do this.  Turn off any compression plugins your device may have, piano does not sound good with compression.  Limiters are ok if used sparingly and you leave ample headroom in your gain test. 

One must test all recording devices before one starts recording.  Being lazy by plopping the recorder down in a random place and hoping for the best won't get you very far, and in the long run may cost you more time and frustration.  Take a few minutes before your session to set up your gear properly. 

If the all-in-one solutions are not meeting your expectations of sound or video quality you need to look at separating mic and camera.  Editing is part of the compromise if you want to get better quality.  The easiest and least expensive method of drastically increasing your recording quality is to separate camera and mics and put each in their optimal place.  You don't need expensive gear to do this. 



Made a Liszt. Need new Handel's for Soler panel & Alkan foil. Will Faure Stein on the way to pick up Mendels' sohn. Josquin get Wolfgangs Schu with Clara. Gone Chopin, I'll be Bach

Offline outin

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #17 on: July 12, 2014, 01:30:15 PM

As is often the case, the optimal position for video camera and mics are not at the same place.  All-in-one video/mic recorders are convenient for practice sessions or casual Youtube vids. However, when one wants to improve upon the sound the video and mics need to be separated.  One needs to balance convenience with quality.

First thing to check is that the mic auto gain is turned off (as mentioned earlier).  Next you would do a recording level test to make sure the loudest sounds you are making are not clipping.  Manually adjust the gain to do this.  Turn off any compression plugins your device may have, piano does not sound good with compression.  Limiters are ok if used sparingly and you leave ample headroom in your gain test. 


Thanks! I have been experimenting a little bit with the settings but I admit I've lacked motivation to spend so much time on this stuff when I really want to play... After getting into the technical stuff I am often too distracted to concentrate on playing...And the video mode does not offer much options for sound. Maybe I just need to record audio the best I can and forget about videos...Who cares how the playing looks if it sounds right? :)

Offline flashyfingers

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Re: Camera recording stuff
Reply #18 on: July 16, 2014, 07:53:31 PM
Thanks, y'all!
I'm hungry
 

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