Stretto in chopin

[pianoman53]

Hi all,

First, Thank you all for the help on the Edition-topic! It has helped me a lot.

Now I have another question.

Chopin uses the term stretto on places that doesn't always "fit".
My teacher, among many others, have the argument: Since he was a teacher, he can just as well have written it as a warning - "don't slow down" rather than "rush".

While I can buy that argument, it somehow doesn't completely convince me. Not the least because of Raoul Koczalski's recordings. He clearly takes the "weird" stretto literal, and was also seen as the most authentic of chopin playing. ... but he is pretty much the only argument. I've looked through the Eigeldinger book, but it doesn't seem to address it. Does anyone of you know where I can find more "evidence"?

Kind regards

[michael_c]

Chopin uses the term stretto on places that doesn't always "fit".

Could you give an example?

[bzzzzzt]

There's one in op 10/12

[pianoman53]

Could you give an example?

One place in the concerto, and one in nocturne op 32/1

[dogperson]

'Stretto' was taken by Chopin from an operatic term for 'push forward' not 'do not slow down'  per the sources below

A few references

The Romantic Generation by Rosen
https://books.google.com/books?id=e7PHS54HqykC&pg=PA335&lpg=PA335&dq=stretto+in+chopin&source=bl&ots=uuOejEgJiZ&sig=JQJQnHJrYbt4Kv60jPlgM0LYgB0&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CB0Q6AEwADgKahUKEwjZjKTE2cnIAhWDJx4KHccXBXE#v=onepage&q=stretto%20in%20chopin&f=false

Page 212 Chopin Studies 2- Rink
https://books.google.com/books?id=UVVqMCoeJIkC&pg=PA178&lpg=PA178&dq=stretto+chopin&source=bl&ots=tA9-z7fQbx&sig=GaDYvx-h2cVRlzSlyO9D0yvYlrc&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CFYQ6AEwCmoVChMI8uiF19rJyAIVy6UeCh0S0A_z#v=onepage&q=stretto%20chopin&f=false

Analysis of Martha Argerich, stretto in Op 28 no 4
https://www.dissonance.ch/upload/pdf/120_31_hsm_os_Argerich.pdf

Analysis of 28, no 4
https://www.grandpianopassion.com/2014/06/30/chopin-prelude-e-minor-amplified/

[michael_c]

One place in the concerto, and one in nocturne op 32/

Where in which concerto? As for the nocturne, the slight speeding up in the stretto makes perfect sense to me.

There's one in op 10/12

Yes, some people slow down there. They shouldn't: the stretto version is more exciting.

[pianoman53]

yes, I know that it doesn't mean "don't slow dowm", yet at least half of pianist reads it this way. So I just want to see if there are any documents that also points out those weird places...

[pianoman53]

Where in which concerto? As for the nocturne, the slight speeding up in the stretto makes perfect sense to me.
Yes, some people slow down there. They shouldn't: the stretto version is more exciting.

I think it's in the f minor, but I don't have the score, so I can't point.. sorry, bad example....

[iansinclair]

As a sort of a general thing, "stretto" really has the implication of a little stressed, a little more forceful... and, with almost no exceptions, a little faster.  But in my humble opinion, it is more important to get the feeling of a bit more stress than it is to rush the music.  One of the best examples is in the Op 9 No.1 nocturne -- not mentioned yet -- where there is a short section which comes twice which is marked stretto, and should be played to make a contrast in feeling with the somewhat less stressful music which precedes it (also twice), never mind the lyric passage following.

[chopinlover01]

I usually interpret stretto as making the passage a little more energetic, depending on the piece.
28/4 I definitely interpret stretto different than the revolutionary.
For me, the best example of stretto is in the Chopin Ballade in F minor starting at 9:10. Rubinstein does it particularly well without rushing, I think. Others that take this more literally include Zimerman, Pollini etc.

[jamaicaway]

Then there's the D minor Prelude 28/24, where stretto appears twice near the end. In this case I really don't want to alter the tempo much: I don't want to end up playing the concluding section faster than the rest of the piece, nor do I want to speed up and then jerk back to the original tempo at m. 65. So I interpret this stretto as "keep up the tension, fight the tendency to slow down in this climactic phrase".
 

[pianoman53]

Yes, so I know that it can be interpret strettos different ways. My question was if there were any documents that explains them better.