Kissin in concert today

[chuckbutler]

Hi gang,

Just came back from a Kissin recital at the New Jersey Performing Arts Center this afternoon.  He's repeating this program at several locations; I'm sure you can find details on the Internet if you're interested.

CHOPIN

Polonaise #1 C#- 26/1
Polonaise #2 Eb- 26/2
Impromptu in Ab 29
Impromptu in F#- 36
Impromptu in Gb 51
Fantasie-Impromptu in C#- 66 (the only thing in the performance that I can play)
Polonaise in C- 40/2
Polonaise in Ab 53

INTERMISSION

MEDTNER

Sonata Reminiscenza in A- 38/1

STRAVINSKY

Petrouchka Suite

The Chopin was beautiful (if you could ignore all the coughing and cell phones going off -- oh my GOD), but I couldn't help but feel that he was "phoning it in".  Don't get me wrong...it's rare that you hear these pieces performed so well...but I've seen Kissin a number of times, and you can tell which pieces he's feeling passionate about.  Today's Chopin seemed fairly ordinary...at least as "ordinary" as listening to a great pianist like Kissin can be!

I had never heard (or even heard _of_) the Medtner piece before.  On first listen I wasn't wild about it (the composition, not the performance), but Kissin seemed to enjoy playing it.  If you are an intermediate to advanced pianist you might want to check it out (if you haven't), it seems like a reasonable piece to tackle.

Then he played the Stravinsky.

Wow.  Obviously it's a pretty bombastic arrangement, and you could see his face light up.  It just the kind of piece that's well-suited for him...full of opportunities to showcase his formidable technique and control throughout the dynamic range of the instrument.  It was really exciting, and the resulting standing ovation led to several encores.

My personal commentary, an admitted fan of Kissin, is that every time I see him I'm amazed by his command of the instrument.  He never reveals any technical weakness (that I can spot).  Some question his "musicianship"; I can't go along with this, as certain of his recordings are among my absolute favorites of those pieces.  I do think he reveals something in the way he bows, however.  His bow is very practiced and stiff.  It is exactly the same every time and he seems a bit uncomfortable to me.  He's completely at ease while he's playing, but when the performance ends and he has to address the audience, he seems to glaze over and almost appears indifferent.  Look...I'm not trying to nit-pick his bow.  The music is what matters.  But I wonder if his life experience has been such that he's just not that comfortable around _people_, and I wonder how much he's been sheltered from "real life" experiences.  You can practice all day and become a great technician, but you have to live and experience life to interpret music.  As I've said, I think he's created some wonderful interpretations (particularly for someone who's only 34), but I wonder if there isn't some additional depth that he might gain if he just spent a little time in the real world.  Maybe this is what those of you who don't hear the passion in his performances are missing?  I don’t know...he sounds great to me...I'd give my left nut to play like that (OK, maybe not).

I began a new thread for this, as I thought some of you who have given up on the "I like/don't like Kissin" thread might miss these notes if I tacked it on there.  Hope you don't mind.

[boygab90]

It was great to watch him. I was there today.

[BoliverAllmon]

I wish he would come to Houston area again some day soon. I have always wanted to listen to him live.

[linza]

I was in that concert too.  I absolutely agree with chuckbutler's description of the concert including the coughing (it seems that some people in the audience were gravely sick and their condition was exuberated by the finest Kissin's pianissimo.) and cell phones going off ( I've never heard of so many cell phones going of at one concert)  People were generally very insensitive (how about clapping while the last note or chord is still in the air and his hands haven't left the piano.?)

Here are some quotes from previous posts about Kissin:

his playing is rather empty of emotion and this probably relates to his upbringing and lack of secure relationships with fellow human beings.

When Kissin plays slowly, he's being boring and acting (emphasis on ACTING)mature

his failures- the four Chopin ballades, the Rachmaninoff Third, Schubert 960, Mephisto  Waltz, the list goes on..

I think his performance was a complete opposite to all of these statements:  he showed deep and genuine emotions, the playing was very much not boring (some of his interpretations are quite different from what I know.  However, why call them boring?) I did not see any acting and the concert was absolute success.  I've been to his concerts  before and this concert is not an exception.  He is a wonderful performer (among the very best today) and he is giving away his heart.  He was also very generous (actually he always is):  he played at least 3-4 encore peaces and that was  after Petrouchka - which is probably among the most difficult peaces for piano.

I don't care about his bows, his looks, and his personal life.  Who am I to judge if he experienced life enough...  Maybe Chopin was also uncomfortable around people and perhaps didn't experienced life the way some people would prefer.  Does that makes his music shallow and emotionless?

Let's judge only by music and performance and in that Kissin was wonderful.

[SteinwayTony]

Let's judge only by music and performance and in that Kissing was wonderful.

Kissing who, might I ask?

[linza]

 

[BoliverAllmon]

Kissing who, might I ask?

[chuckbutler]

I've been to his concerts  before and this concert is not an exception.  He is a wonderful performer (among the very best today) and he is giving away his heart.

I want to make it clear that _I_ absolutely agree.  He is my favorite living pianist.  As soon as I hear someone I like better, I'll let you know.  I was trying to find some explanation as to why everyone here doesn't feel the same way.  Obviously interpretation is subject to individual taste.  I admit that I had some of the criticisms I've heard on this list in the back of my mind as I watched the performance.  The thing with the bows was the only aspect of his character in which I could detect any hint of what _might_ explain how some could react to his playing as "emotionless".  Again, I couldn't disagree more.

He was also very generous (actually he always is):  he played at least 3-4 encore peaces and that was  after Petrouchka - which is probably among the most difficult peaces for piano.

This was the fourth time I've seen him live; he has always played at least four encores on each occasion.

The first time I ever saw him was at the Academy of Music in Philadelphia.  It was about 10 years ago, so he would have been around 24.  It was the single most thrilling piano performance I have ever seen.  It snowed very hard that day, so I was surprised the performance wasn't cancelled.  The Academy was maybe half full...many no-shows due to the weather.  I doubt anyone who was there could ever forget it.  After a program of mostly Bach, he played about ten encores...including many Chopin Etudes, Rach Etudes-Tableux, and a number of pieces I didn't recognize.  It was astonishing, and I was literally breathless when it was over.

I don't care about his bows, his looks, and his personal life.  Who am I to judge if he experienced life enough...  Maybe Chopin was also uncomfortable around people and perhaps didn't experienced life the way some people would prefer.  Does that makes his music shallow and emotionless?

Let's judge only by music and performance and in that Kissin was wonderful.

Again, I agree.  I was only looking for an explanation for those who don't hear it the same way.

BTW...for those who were there...did you hear the young kid who played in the lobby prior to Kissin's performance.  I'd guess he was about 10 or 11...anybody find out who he was??

[stefano]

To those horrible statements about kissin stated earlier. Who ever wrote those doesnt know anything about piano and is just imitating the bad things the stupid critics say about kissin.  He is the best pianist in the world today and there is not denying that.  Who else can sell out carnegie hall in 2 hours......

[tibidi]

I was in that concert too.  I absolutely agree with chuckbutler's description of the concert including the coughing (it seems that some people in the audience were gravely sick and their condition was exuberated by the finest Kissin's pianissimo.) and cell phones going off ( I've never heard of so many cell phones going of at one concert)  People were generally very insensitive (how about clapping while the last note or chord is still in the air and his hands haven't left the piano.?)

No wonder Kissin seemed to be indifferent towards the audiences. With cell phone ringing away and persistent bad coughing going on like that, I would have stood up and throw something at those people, hehe! Shame on these people! It happened to Yundi too in Germany during his very important debut performance in a very big concert hall. Yundi was somewhat  affected according to the reporter, but luckily, those noise was later stopped by someone in the audience.

[tibidi]

some of his interpretations are quite different from what I know. 

 

[BoliverAllmon]

To those horrible statements about kissin stated earlier. Who ever wrote those doesnt know anything about piano and is just imitating the bad things the stupid critics say about kissin.  He is the best pianist in the world today and there is not denying that.  Who else can sell out carnegie hall in 2 hours......

horowitz

[boygab90]

Philadelphia, PA
USA

You traveled a long way to see him. I was suposed to be in a piano audition on the same block NJPAC is,got 2 free tickets and went walking to NJPAC.

[apion]

My personal commentary, an admitted fan of Kissin, is that every time I see him I'm amazed by his command of the instrument.  He never reveals any technical weakness (that I can spot). 

You can practice all day and become a great technician, but you have to live and experience life to interpret music.  As I've said, I think he's created some wonderful interpretations (particularly for someone who's only 34), but I wonder if there isn't some additional depth that he might gain if he just spent a little time in the real world.  Maybe this is what those of you who don't hear the passion in his performances are missing? 

I agree; and I agree.

Just exactly, pray tell, might he spend a little more "time in the real world."    Should he go live with his aunt Olga, the abusive lesbian alcoholic?  Should he spend 3 months traveling in youth hostels? 

I'm just not sure how one achieves this forced "inner depth."   

But I'd like to know, because I know a ton of people who have led sheltered lives ........ 
   

[tibidi]

Hi gang,

 But I wonder if his life experience has been such that he's just not that comfortable around _people_, and I wonder how much he's been sheltered from "real life" experiences.  You can practice all day and become a great technician, but you have to live and experience life to interpret music.  As I've said, I think he's created some wonderful interpretations (particularly for someone who's only 34), but I wonder if there isn't some additional depth that he might gain if he just spent a little time in the real world.  Maybe this is what those of you who don't hear the passion in his performances are missing?  I don’t know...he sounds great to me...I'd give my left nut to play like that (OK, maybe not).

It's wrong to say there is little passion in Kissin's music. Don't try to indoctrinate others.

So, there is only something very vague left for you to criticize Kissin? How well do you know Kissin to say so much nonsense about him?  Some of you here have certainly tried very hard to find fault with Kissin?
 
I can also say,

 “What a pity Rubinstein didn’t marry a few women at the same time as that might have given him some additional depth in his interpretation of music".

lol!

What about Lang Lang's music? Not only that there is no emotion or passion, it's even weird. If you are so good in giving explanation to other pianist, I bet you should be able to explain Lang Lang too.

[steinwayguy]

It's wrong to say there is little passion in Kissin's music. Don't try to indoctrinate others.

So, there is only something very vague left for you to criticize Kissin? How well do you know Kissin to say so much nonsense about him?  Some of you here have certainly tried very hard to find fault with Kissin?
 
I can also say,

 “What a pity Rubinstein didn’t marry a few women at the same time as that might have given him some additional depth in his interpretation of music".

lol!

What about Lang Lang's music? Not only that there is no emotion or passion, it's even weird. If you are so good in giving explanation to other pianist, I bet you should be able to explain Lang Lang too.

I have to hand it to you, tibidi, you have some of the most incoherent and purposeless posts on this forum.

If you really want proof for why Kissin's playing is bad, listen to his Mephisto Waltz. Oh, and by the way, if you say that it's good, I will lose all of the little respect I had for you previously.

[tibidi]

I have to hand it to you, tibidi, you have some of the most incoherent and purposeless posts on this forum.

If you really want proof for why Kissin's playing is bad, listen to his Mephisto Waltz. Oh, and by the way, if you say that it's good, I will lose all of the little respect I had for you previously.

I don’t have this piece played by Kissin. Still, I can imagine how he had played this piece after listening to about 12 CDs of his. I refuse to believe that he had played this piece badly judging from his technique and his musicality. Who is going to judge Kissin only by the way had played this piece? You can never justify the way Kissin has been criticized here. 

[chuckbutler]

You traveled a long way to see him. I was suposed to be in a piano audition on the same block NJPAC is,got 2 free tickets and went walking to NJPAC.

My studio is in Philly, I live in Southern NJ...about a 90 minute drive.  Well worth it.

[chuckbutler]

It's wrong to say there is little passion in Kissin's music. Don't try to indoctrinate others.

So, there is only something very vague left for you to criticize Kissin? How well do you know Kissin to say so much nonsense about him?  Some of you here have certainly tried very hard to find fault with Kissin?

You're taking my comments entirely out of context.  I suggest you reread the entire thread, and the criticisms of Kissen on the other Board.  I was merely trying to find some explanation for why others might feel the way they do.  I am a Kissen fan, and love his interpretations.

[chuckbutler]

Just exactly, pray tell, might he spend a little more "time in the real world."    Should he go live with his aunt Olga, the abusive lesbian alcoholic?  Should he spend 3 months traveling in youth hostels? 

I'm just not sure how one achieves this forced "inner depth."   
   

Again, please take my earlier remarks in context.  I love Kissen's interpretations; others do not.  I'm trying to understand why.  Kissen has been treated as a prodigy from a very young age.  I do not know what his life has been like; I can only imagine that it must have been _very_ different from the average kid.  On the one hand this has afforded him the opportunity to develop into an exceptional pianist.  But there is obviously a cost for that, in terms of life experience.  I was simply wondering if _maybe_ those of you who do not care for his interpretations are hearing something lacking in that regard.  I do not.  I'm trying to understand those who do.

[chuckbutler]

If you really want proof for why Kissin's playing is bad, listen to his Mephisto Waltz. Oh, and by the way, if you say that it's good, I will lose all of the little respect I had for you previously.

Well, you don't know _me_, therefore you have no basis for respect.  So I'll bite...

I think his Mephisto recording is the best I've heard.  I've been listening to it over and over.  I own several other recordings of the piece.  I have attemped to play it, but I don't posess sufficient technique (yet).  I will probably come back to it from time to time, as I really like it.

I'd be very interested to know specifically (1) what you don't like about Kissen's recording and (2) whose recording you _do_ like.  Thanks.

[chuckbutler]

I am a Kissen fan, and love his interpretations.

And since I'm such a fan, I should probably spell his name right: Kissin.  Sorry.  cb

[tibidi]

You're taking my comments entirely out of context.  I suggest you reread the entire thread, and the criticisms of Kissen on the other Board.  I was merely trying to find some explanation for why others might feel the way they do.  I am a Kissen fan, and love his interpretations.

I had read the entire thread and I have understood you very well. I can even read your mind.

Is what these people feel about Kissin also what you feel?  Why do you have to take these people so seriously and tend to agree with them by stressing so much on Kissin's social avtivity?

No need to argue about it any more.

[BoliverAllmon]

I had read the entire thread and I have understood you very well. I can even read your mind.

Is what these people feel about Kissin also what you feel?  Why do you have to take these people so seriously and tend to agree with them by stressing so much on Kissin's social avtivity?

No need to argue about it any more.

no need to argue in the first place. GEEZ. some like him some don't. oh well.

[SDL]

yeah - Ive never liked him.  Hes technically good (which is what most threads on this forum seem to be driven by) but he's boring.  I can completely understand about "needing to live in the real world").  No it doesnt mean do more things.  But I think if someone has difficulty coming out of their shell or they haven't experienced life as a person who has to put up with the hardships of having no money, coping with ill health in the family or having to go to work you hate, or "general public" type problems I think thats what is meant as the "real world".  Its a generalisation and I can't comment on Kissin's life.   We all have different circumstances that make or break our personalities.  All I can say is maybe Kissin is missing something in life that may/not unleash a certain "je n'ais sais pas" to the performance that people including myself think is missing from his music.

[linza]

I can completely understand about "needing to live in the real world").  .... if someone has difficulty coming out of their shell or they haven't experienced life as a person who has to put up with the hardships of having no money, coping with ill health in the family or having to go to work you hate, or "general public" type problems I think thats what is meant as the "real world".

Aha!  So you do understand what that means?  Then you must be the first one out there to know it because the greatest minds of all times has debated this issue and had not reached a definitive conclusion.  Congratulation!

Please don't try to explain things you don't like by deficiencies in his life experience.  We cannot possibly know what's necessary to experience in order to be best at music  interpretation.  So if I experienced more life problems than Kissing I should be better pianist by default?  So a person who never had money hardship is incapable of compassion?  Someone who never had to work at the factory can't express his feelings?  Oh come on!  Also how do we even know what he experienced or didn't?
Also saying Kissin is bad or boring is very much wrong.  Not because he can't be bad or boring, but because it is a ridiculous generalization.  WHAT EXACTLY was bad (everything he ever played?)  WHAT EXACTLY was boring (also everything?)  There is hardly a single performer out there who is boring or bad at absolutely everything. 

I also do not like blindly everything that Kissin has ever played.  For example I don't like _some_ of his preludes from one of the old CD.  (recorded about 10 years ago or so)  I can pinpoint each prelude that I do not like and explain what exactly I do not like about it.  On the other hand there are other preludes from the same disk that I like. 
Well, he is a person capable of thinking differently from me and you.  He is also capable of changing his interpretations as the time goes.  Well, it only proves that he is a human being, not a robot.

[tibidi]

Aha!  So you do understand what that means?  Then you must be the first one out there to know it because the greatest minds of all times has debated this issue and had not reached a definitive conclusion.  Congratulation!

Please don't try to explain things you don't like by deficiencies in his life experience.  We cannot possibly know what's necessary to experience in order to be best at music  interpretation.  So if I experienced more life problems than Kissing I should be better pianist by default?  So a person who never had money hardship is incapable of compassion?  Someone who never had to work at the factory can't express his feelings?  Oh come on!  Also how do we even know what he experienced or didn't?
Also saying Kissin is bad or boring is very much wrong.  Not because he can't be bad or boring, but because it is a ridiculous generalization.  WHAT EXACTLY was bad (everything he ever played?)  WHAT EXACTLY was boring (also everything?)  There is hardly a single performer out there who is boring or bad at absolutely everything. 

I also do not like blindly everything that Kissin has ever played.  For example I don't like _some_ of his preludes from one of the old CD.  (recorded about 10 years ago or so)  I can pinpoint each prelude that I do not like and explain what exactly I do not like about it.  On the other hand there are other preludes from the same disk that I like. 
Well, he is a person capable of thinking differently from me and you.  He is also capable of changing his interpretations as the time goes.  Well, it only proves that he is a human being, not a robot.

Why are you people so interested in Kissin? So much nonsense written here. I give up.

[SDL]

hey linza - try reading my thread all through next time before coming to your aggressive conclusion!  I said I can't comment on Kissin's life.  I also referred to a comment earlier in the thread - someone said about kissin "living in the real world".  I put "" marks around it and was trying to quantify what this person may have meant, since someone after that said what does that mean - like have more adventures or words to that affect

I don't suppose that there are one set of answers.  I was trying to say there are certain things that spark off someone's personality.  Had they not gone through that experience they may not be a better/worse person.  Had they not experienced this experience maybe they would be able to open up/or not.  See?!  Perhaps you need more experiences like this!

[Regulus Medtner]

Now, as any psychiatric diagnosis  about Kissin tend to become a little boring after a number of posts, I would be very interested to know how he played the Medtner sonata. And preferably by those who attended the concert(s)! How did you like it? From the recordings I've heard, I don't really like many of Kissin's interpretations but the fact that he is one of the very few who program and perform Medtner's music in public earns my respect.

[BoliverAllmon]

I honestly feel that the people who complain about Kissin are the same kind of people that complain about MT. They are just jealous. It is one thing not to like how he does some things, but grow up.

[linza]

Dear SDL,  I thought you said

I can completely understand about "needing to live in the real world"

  then you also explained what you think that means.  I found it funny as I believe that many philosophers discussed this and haven't agreed about what that means.   In any case I didn't wanted to offend you, please accept my apologies.

What I was also saying is that many people throw generalized comments about Kissin like "Kissin is bad"  or "Kissin is boring"  and the only explanation they have about it is Kissin's insufficient life experience.  To me it all sounds wrong and I explained why.

Perhaps you need more experiences like this!

But, of course!  Who doesn't?

[linza]

I would be very interested to know how he played the Medtner sonata.

Unfortunately I've never hear this one before, so I have nothing to compare his performance against.  I enjoyed how he played it,  but I got immersed in listening to the music and pretty much forgot about the performer (this must be a good thing).  I loved how great he handled dynamics.  His pianissimo was literally breathtaking, and you can hear every single note.

Like I said, there is nothing in his performance that can be called "boring", "bad", "purely technical", "formalistic", etc

[linza]

It is one thing not to like how he does some things, but grow up.

I absolutely agree.

[SDL]

I can assure you Im not jealous  .  Are you saying I dont like Kissin's playing because Im jealous?!   I like Hamelin, Louis Lortie, Pires and many others.  So why am I not jealous of these people.  You would need a motive to be jealous.  What could my motive be?!  There are loads of pianists better than me!! 

I think this has been blown up all out of proportion.  A few fans getting all defensive about their "god".  Nuff said.

[BoliverAllmon]

I can assure you Im not jealous  .  Are you saying I dont like Kissin's playing because Im jealous?!   I like Hamelin, Louis Lortie, Pires and many others.  So why am I not jealous of these people.  You would need a motive to be jealous.  What could my motive be?!  There are loads of pianists better than me!! 

I think this has been blown up all out of proportion.  A few fans getting all defensive about their "god".  Nuff said.

Kissin is not my "god", but he is definately not Satan.

[hodi]

i have heard that kissin has some mental/personal problems
can anyone tell me about that?

[Motrax]

I heard Kissin two or three weeks ago.

In regards to the Medtner sonata, Kissin played it very well. His dynamic contrasts are indeed expertly implemented, and his overall concept of the piece was very good. There are a few spots I found to be a bit tedious (I only have hamelin's recording to compare - I haven't played the piece myself), but then some sections were absolutely breathtaking. Aside from his encores, I would call it the highlight of the evening. (though with that said, there's still a lot of room for someone to come along and play it better)

Kissin seems like a kinda strange guy, but that's really none of anyone's business, in my opinion.