Haw to wipeout America.

[zheer]

  No not an exremist, just dont like beeing told what to think and what to do all the fuc**ing time.

[zheer]

You better check out his latest post.

He seems to have interesting ideas on how to improve England.

   Your kidding me right , OUT LAW TO THE DAY I DIE Fu**m.

[da jake]

You talk pretty tough, Zheer. If the West and it's cultures and values are so bad, you might as well renounce everything Western.  Start by tossing your computer by the curb. Most of it's components were likely designed in the United States/Europe.

[prometheus]

Do you honestly think a war can be fought without innocent civilians dying? Maybe if we go back 600 years and fight on “THE BATTLEFIELD”. Perhaps countries should mark out a battlefield with white lines and any country that bombs outside them gets a yellow card. Two yellow cards and they automatically lose the war.

Police shoot innocent victims because they mistake them for criminals. It's too bad real criminals don’t run around in black & white striped overalls wearing masks like they do in cartoons. It would make crime fighting so much easier.

That's where Einsteins famous quote come into the picture, or rather the idea behind it that was supported and is supported by many similar intellectuals today. Like Russel and Chomsky, etc. War is no longer feasable with current day technology.


And again, there is a lot of discussion about the tactic to use against Hezbollah in Israel. The military want to use foot soldiers. But the politicians don't want to bear the responisbility for the Israeli casualties that would be the result. So this means you either will fail or you will have to kill many many many more civilians.


And about Hezbollah hiding among whatever cover they can find. This is called guerilla warfare or asymmetric warfare. This happens when there is an imbalance in power. So the solution is easy. Have the US give Hezbollah as many planes, tanks etc as Israel has so they no longer have to hide. Right?


As for support for Hezbollah. Lebanon has had a long civil war and contains many different kind of people. Hezbollah is shi'a. Lebanon also contains many sunni, christians and druzes. When Israel started to bomb hezbollah positions many people where kind of positive about this because the Lebanese government has not been able to solve this Iranian and Syrian proxy army. Even some Lebanese shi'ites were happy Israel was trying to destroy Hezbollah. But because Israel is unable to defeat Hezbollah and killing 9 civilians for every hezbollah soldier killed even christians and druzes start to get angry.

Hezbollah has been very popular after Israel withdrawed. But then they turned obsolete and into a Irianian-Syrian proxy rather than the organisation that saved them from Israel. But now that Israel again positioned itself as not only the enemy of Hezbollah but the enemy of Lebanon as a whole, Hezbollah is gaining its former support and glory; it is not only no longer obsolete. It is also essential and succesful.

[pianolearner]

You talk pretty tough, Zheer. If the West and it's cultures and values are so bad, you might as well renounce everything Western.  Start by tossing your computer by the curb. Most of it's components were likely designed in the United States/Europe.

Exactly. Iran isn't being bombed (yet). Why not live there instead of England?

[bernhard]

You talk pretty tough, Zheer. If the West and it's cultures and values are so bad, you might as well renounce everything Western.  Start by tossing your computer by the curb. Most of it's components were likely designed in the United States/Europe.

I thought that they were being designed in Japan and manufactured in China.

[prometheus]

   Well this is a very personal question, but i plan once the UK is under heavy bombardment similar to those bombs droped on Iraq, to retreat and watch the action unfold in a village in the north of Iraq. That will be the day of true celebration a victorious day indeed.

So you are going to celebrate when nothing has changed, the violence goes on, except that the victim and culprit have changed position? Obviously this is no improvement at all.

[zheer]

You talk pretty tough, Zheer. If the West and it's cultures and values are so bad, you might as well renounce everything Western.  Start by tossing your computer by the curb. Most of it's components were likely designed in the United States/Europe.

   What culture , what value , i dont own anything that is american or british, The only Americans i have ever spoken to are on this forum, the only thing that is british is my pasport, the reast well you know built made by other nations. Sheesh,and by the way there is a Nazi party in progress here in the UK.

[da jake]

I thought that they were being designed in Japan and manufactured in China.

Well, the basic technology comes from the United States and is invested in and elaborated upon by Japan.

PS: Japan is a Western country. China is basically a capitalist economy anyway.

[da jake]

   What culture , what value , i dont own anything that is american or british, The only Americans i have ever spoken to are on this forum, the only thing that is british is my pasport, the reast well you know built made by other nations. Sheesh,and by the way there is a Nazi party in progress here in the UK.

You don't own anything American or British?

Ever drink Coca-Cola? Talk on a cell-phone? Pay for your electricity bills? Have running water?

How woefully stupid are you?

[pianolearner]

That's where Einsteins famous quote come into the picture, or rather the idea behind it that was supported and is supported by many similar intellectuals today. Like Russel and Chomsky, etc. War is no longer feasable with current day technology.


And again, there is a lot of discussion about the tactic to use against Hezbollah in Israel. The military want to use foot soldiers. But the politicians don't want to bear the responisbility for the Israeli casualties that would be the result. So this means you either will fail or you will have to kill many many many more civilians.


And about Hezbollah hiding among whatever cover they can find. This is called guerilla warfare or asymmetric warfare. This happens when there is an imbalance in power. So the solution is easy. Have the US give Hezbollah as many planes, tanks etc as Israel has so they no longer have to hide. Right?


As for support for Hezbollah. Lebanon has had a long civil war and contains many different kind of people. Hezbollah is shi'a. Lebanon also contains many sunni, christians and druzes. When Israel started to bomb hezbollah positions many people where kind of positive about this because the Lebanese government has not been able to solve this Iranian and Syrian proxy army. Even Lebanese shi'ites were happy Israel was trying to destroy Hezbollah. But because Israel is unable to defeat Hezbollah and killing 9 civilians for every hezbollah soldier killed even christians and druzes start to get angry.

Hezbollah has been very popular after Israel withdrawed. But then they turned obsolete and into a Irianian-Syrian proxy rather than the organisation that saved them from Israel. But now that Israel again positioned itself as not only the enemy of Hezbollah but the enemy of Lebanon as a whole, Hezbollah is gaining its former support and glory; it is not only no longer obsolete. It is also essential and succesful.

Hezbollah ignored the golden rule. Never start a war unless you think you can win. Nobody gave America what it needed to become a superpower which proves democracy is conducive to progress. In all honesty, as long as Israeli & Hezbollah bombs aren't landing in this country I don't really care about what is happening in Lebanon. I live in England because I love the country and what it offers. If we ever come under attack from an enemy I hope America would come to our aid.

[zheer]

So you are going to celebrate when nothing has changed, the violence goes on, except that the victim and culprit have changed position? Obviously this is no improvement at all.

  Violence will never end. I guess you are right its no celebration.

[bernhard]

Well, the basic technology comes from the United States and is invested in and elaborated upon by Japan.

PS: Japan is a Western country. China is basically a capitalist economy anyway.

Yikes! Globalisation has truly arrived!

[pianistimo]

despite policies we may like or not like of our own respective countries - we can each take responsibility for our own actions.  supporting terror is not something that will gain you virgins in paradise.  it will likely cause your death, though.  those who live by the sword usually die by the sword.  why don't you hole out until it blows over.  (i know, easy to say)  but truly, war pulls on people's emotions and makes them do idiotic things.  if you see an enemy - you are likely to kill them just because.  not because there is any really good reason.  tit-for-tat.

to make a change in the world - you have to be willing to die for others.  to put yourself in their place.  to appreciate their world.  i don't think many people or countries want or are willing to do this.  or, would want to give away their resources.  but, if we are to see God's involvement in the world - it would be to completely turn the paradigm of government upside down.  the rich would serve the poor.  the mighty would protect the weak.  the hungry would be fed - and even though it might seem socialist - it would also have to be somewhat dictatorial because there are always those who want to take blessings and be greedy and keep them all for themselves.

[pianolearner]

  , the only thing that is british is my pasport,
 

Exactly. They hand them out too easily.

[prometheus]

And Japan must have experiences a very intense 津波 overnight, throwing all its Islands far far west.

[zheer]

You don't own anything American or British?

Ever drink Coca-Cola? Talk on a cell-phone? Pay for your electricity bills? Have running water?

How woefully stupid are you?

  No i dont drink coca cola or speak on a cell-phone, and no the water is not American nor is the elctricity.

[da jake]

Hezbollah ignored the golden rule. Never start a war unless you think you can win. Nobody gave America what it needed to become a superpower which proves democracy is conducive to progress. In all honesty, as long as Israeli & Hezbollah bombs aren't landing in this country I don't really care about what is happening in Lebanon. I live in England because I love the country and what it offers. If we ever come under attack from an enemy I hope America would come to our aid.

That's right.

A Hezbollah official ADMITTED that they were not prepared for the Israeli response. The plan was to, backed by their Syrian and Iranian overlords, kill some Israelis, and retreat after the international community brokered a swift cease-fire in response to Israeli "aggression". Unfortunately, Israel was in no mood to f*ck around, and now Hezbollah strongholds in southern Lebanon are being obliterated by Israeli bombs and decimated by highly-trained Israeli commandos.

[zheer]

Exactly. They hand them out too easily.

  Am Welsh.

[da jake]

  No i dont drink coca cola or speak on a cell-phone, and no the water is not American nor is the elctricity.

Yeah, the electricity and water is british. Just like the cereal that is forming the sh*t in your intestines was grown in British fields.

Oh, and what kind of computer are you on right now, dimwit?

[bernhard]

You don't own anything American or British?

Ever drink Coca-Cola? Talk on a cell-phone? Pay for your electricity bills? Have running water?

How woefully stupid are you?

Actually, I don´t drink Coca cola (or any soft drink). I would thinks with all the information about the crap that goes into its manufacture it would be woefully stupid of ayone to drink the stuff (Coca Cola now has a mineral water which is also full of chemicals).

And no, I do not have a cell-phone or talk into one (I heard it fries your brain).

Ah, yes, electricity bills. Nope. I have a waterfall in my property and we have a minipower plant so no electricity bills.

So, you drink coke, you pay electricity bills and you fry your brain talking on cell phones? That is really clever of you.
 

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[da jake]

Well, Bernhard, props to you. Since you live in a state of autarkal self-sufficiency, you might as well declare independence - the Kingdom of BERNHARDIA. Can I be a duke? 

[zheer]

Oh, and what kind of computer are you on right now, dimwit?

  Trust me its not American.,

[da jake]

Was it designed in Iran?  Tell me Zheer, what kind of OS are you running on it?

[pianistimo]

life used to be much slower.  you'd wait an hour for your clothes to dry on the line.  but, sometimes they blew away.

that gives me an idea.  how much fighting would people do if they all suddenly lost their clothes on the clothes line?  say we gather at the french riviera.  joking of course.  people might start fighting over tennis shoes.

there is no beauty to war.  the moment (in seventh) grade i saw the burn victim of nagasaki running down the street (at eight years old or something) i knew the war was utterly beyond anything humans had ever done before.  to have 3/4 of your body burned and melting.  for all the victims on both sides of the iraqi war and both sides on palestinian and israeli - it's too much pain.  it's psychotic.  why make the other side suffer at all.  why must war exist.  why do people want to inflict pain on others.  it's not understandable.

[zheer]

Was it designed in Iran?  Tell me Zheer, what kind of OS are you running on it?

  Look, its probably made in China designed by the japaness, stolen by the American.

[da jake]

Stolen by the JEWS no less.

Seriously, go get an education.

[pianolearner]

  Am Welsh.

It was a general comment.  It seems many foreigners hate everything British but gladly accept the passport!

[zheer]

Stolen by the JEWS no less.

Seriously, go get an education.

  Come on am winning ( yaunning)

[prometheus]

Doesn't everyone need one? You don't need to embrace the British stereotype before you can be British.

I am dutch. I can't ice skate, I hate all dutch food, I oppose the monarchy, I don't think we should be proud of our christian-jewish-humanist tradition, etc. I have no feelings of nationalism. But does that mean I have to burn my passport and become stateless?

[pianistimo]

there are many ways to kill people - but why not be different and write a book about how to care for others.

[da jake]

Denmark and the Netherlands are the two most liberal and welcoming countries in Europe.

When some editorial cartoons generate calls for "death to Denmark" and boycotts of Danish goods...and movies about backwards Islamic culture in the Middle East get the director assassinated in the Netherlands you know there is a clash of cultures of which one is clearly from the Dark Aages.

[zheer]

  Well said prometheus.

[bernhard]

Well, Bernhard, props to you. Since you live in a state of autarkal self-sufficiency, you might as well declare independence - the Kingdom of BERNHARDIA. Can I be a duke? 

Soon to be an Empire.

And no,. you cannot be a Duke. There are protocols and procedures for that. First you must prove your valour and dedication to Bernhardia. Then you are Sired. Then if you keep behaving well a fiefdom may be on your way, and you become a Baron. And so on and so forth. 

(I was expecting you to say that Survivalism was an American philosophy. How disappointing ).

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[zheer]

Denmark and the Netherlands are the two most liberal and welcoming countries in Europe.

 

  Apparently not.

[pianolearner]

  Look, its probably made in China designed by the japaness, stolen by the American.

You can't say that about the Internet. Its definitely American...and you *ARE* using it!

[zheer]

Soon to be an Empire.


(I was expecting you to say that Survivalism was an American philosophy. How disappointing ).

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

  Survivalism , good one.

[da jake]

You can't say that about the Internet. Its definitely American...and you *ARE* using it!

Don't waste your time. He's a total cretin.

[pianolearner]

Doesn't everyone need one? You don't need to embrace the British stereotype before you can be British.

I am dutch. I can't ice skate, I hate all dutch food, I oppose the monarchy, I don't think we should be proud of our christian-jewish-humanist tradition, etc. I have no feelings of nationalism. But does that mean I have to burn my passport and become stateless?

You were born in The Netherlands. I can't see the logic of leaving a country that you supposedly love and moving to a country that you despise. Not that I despise it, but I wouldn't want to live in Iran let alone apply for citizenship there, no matter how bad England got. Does that make more sense?

[pianistimo]

survivalism is a worldwide philosophy.  i think it's the philosophy of humans in general.  at least that's what they teach in psychology classes.

why don't we switch focus from fighting over oil - to the global warming.  i mean - how idiotic can we get?

[da jake]

@Bernhard: Thought about it, but I realized that Zheer is trying to make an absolutely impossible argument.  Almost everyone on the planet has been influenced by American technology, culture, and innovation. Your idea was clever, but the argument in general has become rather tedious.

[thalbergmad]

Doesn't everyone need one? You don't need to embrace the British stereotype before you can be British.

I am dutch. I can't ice skate, I hate all dutch food, I oppose the monarchy, I don't think we should be proud of our christian-jewish-humanist tradition, etc. I have no feelings of nationalism. But does that mean I have to burn my passport and become stateless?

If you wanted to bomb Amsterdam, fly to another country and celebrate, you should burn your passport.

[da jake]

You were born in The Netherlands. I can't see the logic of leaving a country that you supposedly love and moving to a country that you despise. Not that I despise it, but I wouldn't want to live in Iran let alone apply for citizenship there, no matter how bad England got. Does that make more sense?

The President of Iran talks about how great the world would be if Israel were wiped off the face of the earth. This, coupled with their nuclear ambitions, does not sit very well with most people. Human development Index (HDI) UK - 15 (2006), Netherlands - 12 (2006). HDI Iran - 99 (2006).

The UK, Netherlands or Iran...Gee...tough one?

[prometheus]

You were born in The Netherlands. I can't see the logic of leaving a country that you supposedly love and moving to a country that you despise. Not that I despise it, but I wouldn't want to live in Iran let alone apply for citizenship there, no matter how bad England got. Does that make more sense?

I don't despise the country. On the contrary. I just don't think there is some kind of static dutch culture I have to become part of to be able to keep my passport.

As for Zheer, it isn't clear if he was born in the UK or not. Plus, if you are a politcal refugee why should you embrace the 'static culture' of the country you, or your parents, picked to live in? If there is a war here and I have to flee to, for example, the US. I would never be able to become an american. Same goes if I flee to Japan. I could never eat with chop sticks.

Why should anyone assimilate into what you view as the 'static cultural identity' of your country?

[pianolearner]

If you wanted to bomb Amsterdam, fly to another country and celebrate, you should burn your passport.

Well said!

[da jake]

Yeah, I'm sure you would fit well in Arab streets where they celebrate suicide bombing, terrorists attacks. Actually: never mind. If they knew you were Kurdish they'd probably celebrate your demise as well.

[prometheus]

If you wanted to bomb Amsterdam, fly to another country and celebrate, you should burn your passport.

You are right. But I think Zheer already retreated that comment. I think his point was that westerners would react differently if it was their country being bombed. Then he added the statement he  retreated that he would celebrate. The middle east is constantly being bombed by american bombs. It is not that strange that they blame the US. But the reaction of some western people is totally indifferent. I would be really annoyed if that happened to me too.

[zheer]

.  Almost everyone on the planet has been influenced by American technology, culture,  

  Almost everyone has been influenced by American ideology and Movies.

[thalbergmad]

This is an excellent thread and i thank everyone for their contributions.

However, I am tired and need some rest.

I go to bed with the comforting thought that there are many British passport holders who wish to bomb the hell out of my Country and that President Bliar and his pathetic cronies will let in many more.

R I P England.

[pianolearner]

I don't despise the country. On the contrary. I just don't think there is some kind of static dutch culture I have to become part of to be able to keep my passport.

As for Zheer, it isn't clear if he was born in the UK or not. Plus, if you are a politcal refugee why should you embrace the 'static culture' of the country you, or your parents, picked to live in? If there is a war here and I have to flee to, for example, the US. I would never be able to become an american. Same goes if I flee to Japan. I could never eat with chop sticks.

Why should anyone assimilate into what you view as the 'static cultural identity' of your country?

Maybe my point isn't clear enough. If Iran invaded England I wouldn't flee to Iran for sanctuary, demand and get the rights to practice my own customs all while hoping it start's getting bombed so I could return to England and celebrate.