Rap IS NOT Music

[rob47]

Luis is my favourite member of this forum.

next to possibly SteinwayTony

[mikeyg]

Luis is my favourite member of this forum.

next to possibly SteinwayTony

Since nils deleted my thread...

STEINWAYTONY, I'M CALLING YOU OUT!

all I see is two passive-aggressive schoolgirls.

Dis is unnaceptable.  Nobody disses da MikeyG without getting the consequences.  I'll be in New York this weekend.  I'll bring my gang, you bring yours, and we'll settle this like men.  I'll even let you choose the location.  I was thinking central park, but we can move it indoors if it is too hot out.

Be prepared.

[hodi]

I think that the whole music in the last 10 years is just a disaster
unlike in the 19 century, where classical geniuses ruled the world, now every moron with an iq of 40 thinks he can make good music - such as rap.

[i_m_robot]

for all you know their IQs could exceed yours

and dont respond by saying that it not possible because they rap

cause self raps and selfs smarter than Einstein

well... almost

....

@_@

Okay he beat self by six points but you understand what self is saying

[Barbosa-piano]

 I do not like rap, or anything that is derivated from it. This is a very easy diffusion of violence, imorality, drug abuse, and those inapropriate dances from primitive times, which dates back to village days! The ridiculous taste of very imoral and non-musical mixture of rhythm, words and noise. Also, a complete abandon of correct English usage and pronunciation. This is a virus that is impregnating in the young people's minds. Well, rap is a "music" genre created in the slums, that comes from a revolted people, one that cannot progress, in other words, an ignorant one.
 I'm sorry, but I hate everything about rap, from the bouncing Cadillacs and bling blings on the videos to the noise that they call music. I am sorry if I went to far on this, but hey... Rachmaninoff said: "time may change the technique of music, but it will not affect its fundamental mission"  that was to bring relief, and to express the deepest feelings of the heart and mind. Well, since I believe Rap is not music, I believe Rachmaninoff is still correct.

Just my opinion...

[pianonut]

ok.  give us a rap that incorporates einsteins E=mc2 and uses the word self many times.

ps no violence or sexual innuendos.  just plain science and music mixed with a lot of self-indulgence.  (wonders what this will do to the listeners?)  ok.  you can add a little bit of robot moves.  >>
             <<
              >>

ps. do i dare ask this question?  my daughter listens to a song entitled 'holla back, girl.'  now, my three year old is jiving to this.  what does it all mean?  she already hollers back.  will she be a rap artist later for being allowed to hear her sister's music (wanted her to be a pianist like me )

[Siberian Husky]

I do not like rap, or anything that is derivated from it. This is a very easy diffusion of violence, imorality, drug abuse, and those inapropriate dances from primitive times, which dates back to village days! The ridiculous taste of very imoral and non-musical mixture of rhythm, words and noise. Also, a complete abandon of correct English usage and pronunciation. This is a virus that is impregnating in the young people's minds. Well, rap is a "music" genre created in the slums, that comes from a revolted people, one that cannot progress, in other words, an ignorant one.
 I'm sorry, but I hate everything about rap, from the bouncing Cadillacs and bling blings on the videos to the noise that they call music. I am sorry if I went to far on this, but hey... Rachmaninoff said: "time may change the technique of music, but it will not affect its fundamental mission"  that was to bring relief, and to express the deepest feelings of the heart and mind. Well, since I believe Rap is not music, I believe Rachmaninoff is still correct.

Just my opinion...

awww you are sooo cute...

"i hate everything about rap"..you know not even ONE percentage of what rap is..so your further proving what i'v redundantly stated many times on this thread..you blindly and irrantionally judge what you know nothing of...you judge based on observations and assumptions..i'll allow YOU..based on what i just to you..to re-measure the depth of your opinion...

also...to back up what i just said...how do i know you know nothing of rap?..because your only discriptions are superficial depictions.."bling bling"..cadillacs?...drugs?..money?..impregnating young women?...look..Barbosa this goes directly from me to you..do yourself a favor and rid yourself of such an ignorant and ugly theory of mind..it only cripples you..and do the following

Download
Binary Star- "reality check"..this is a RAP song about how money shouldnt be the center of life..philosophical ideas are thrown about in regards to true importance in life..intelligence...and no..this isnt my "interpretation" on the song..like i said..research youfself

Common-" i used to love her"- a story about a man who lost his love
Common-"the light" a poetic dedication to the ONE woman he loves (in this case was Erikah Badu)

Common-" retrospect" - a powerful song messaging how one shouldnt allow vices to onw one's life...in regards to drugs...mistakes in life...Common is a very powerful MC..a poet at best

Talib Kweli-"the truth"-  his perspective on life, God, and creation...also his philosophies on "truth" through metaphors

Atmosphere-"gods bathroom floor" - this is Atmosphere's perspective on religion as seen through described tribulations...

i can go forever..i really can...

whats that?..i couldnt hear you?..you havnt heard any of these songs?...well..no sh!t buddy....look..this isnt directed specifically towards you..but your cute disregard for something you dont know only looks like the pinnacle of immaturity displayed through some fixation that you obtain  in regards to some superior slice of light you seem to shed with music...


"Rap is a music created in the slums"-Barbosa

you voted for bush didnt you?...what about the slums?..what about the Ghetto?...i can vouche for the individuals who express turmoil through poetry because i'v been there, i'v lived in the Missions of the inner city..it isnt pretty...but man oh man it is easy for you to judge comfortably from the luxury of your well tempered home and neighborhood...as you call a non profit organization and donate your 2.50 to clear your concience...the point is...once again..your not entitled to critique what you dont know...


this may be flying all over your uneducated heads...or going through one ear and out the other..so allow me to put this in perspective for all you who believe you have Rap all figured out thanks to MTV BET and VH1...ehem

"Rap is garbage music from the slums"="Classical music is boring stuffy and for old people"

"all they talk about in rap is money sex and drugs"="all classical music is screeching violins and that dorky piano"

"only half witt idiots with little intelligence listen to rap"="only stuck up rich white people listen to classical music"

also...let me put this for you in another angle...

50 cent= chopsticks

Atmosphere=Rachmaninoff 3rd


lets try and grow up people its easy just take your head from out your ass...peace

[Barbosa-piano]

 I'm sorry, you are correct, Siberian Husky, I should abandon this thinking... Maybe it is all because I based it on the only way I saw it. My brother started behaving differently after listening to too much Rap music. He started using those lines and other imoral customs, which I stupidly connected to the music... Well, when I say this, I mean the music that P. Diddy, and that Ciara women write... I've never seen Rap from a point different than P. Diddy, and others of today.
Again, I didn't mean to get anyone mad, and I admit I went too far...
Peace.

[Siberian Husky]

you know what..i really commend you for that...alot of people with that theory of mind are so established and concrete that it manifests itself into a fixation...

and i can identify with your experience with your brother...media rap changes people..i will not ever justify that womanizing is right..that drugs are right..nor will i ever reflect myself as an individual whom money is no object to...you see..the point is..i understand where your judgement comes from..i understand why you thought the way you did..and i understand why people are so quick to point fingers...but it just really pains me to see a beautiful art be victimized by stereotypes...the same stereotypical notions that feed racism..the same sterotypical notions that contribute to inequality..but to back myself up a bit..tis never a good thing to overgeneralize off observations..your only setting yourself up for personal deprivation of growth...


the more you knoOoOow..*star swipe*...the more you GROoOoW!

[pianonut]

rap would be cool if the guys didn't point to their 'you know what.'  i think they're all stereotypically wanting to 'get in on' on stage.  now, who in their right mind (classically thinking here) would do that in public if they were playing rach 3 at the same time.  for one thing, they wouldn't have any hands to do obscene gestures.  and, they probably have enough going on with their feet to have no reason to jive around too much.

civilization as it stands depends on classical artists. 

(ok.  shoot me at the gas station - it will save me paying the price of gas)

ps  i didn't grow up rich either. 

pss  i don't doubt there are some good rap songs.  and, i understand about poetry in motion, and expression of self, surroundings, life.  sometimes it's exposure to something in a comfortable setting, and having a true artist instead of someone off the street just communicatin' jive.  same with gospel music.  there's some great artists, great choirs, and very improvisation- talented people - and then there's the sliding pitch that goes too far.  suppose it's the same with classical music - when it's not played well, it's just not that great.

[Siberian Husky]

no..you dont understand poetry in motion..you dont understand expression..nor surroundings..nor life..nor anything else you mentioned..

someone off the street communicatin jive?...instead of a true artist?..

translation:

opinion, opinion, subjectivism, opinion, self thought out formulation, opinion, opinion

[pianonut]

what i appreciate is the right to express my own opinion.  what you are expressing is your opinion (expressed freely).  if i do not listen to a lot of rap music, what is it to you?  are you getting angry for nothing?  what if i never listen to another rap song again.  does it hurt you?

[Siberian Husky]

never said it was a fact..you wanna fight or somethin pianonut?..i'll definately throw down

[pianonut]

do you think i would be on this thread if i wasn't looking for trouble?  com mon. 

[Siberian Husky]

lets do this...tonight..behind the bleachers at the old park on central


no knives..no bottles..and no immigration patrol..lets get down punk

[pianonut]

bleachers?  central park?

how about steinway hall at 3 am.  i hear that real concert pianists go in there to practice.  if you play better than i do, i'll take you out for a cheesesteak sandwich at a rap joint.

 




 

[ame]

Being prejudiced against something is the worst thing.

The reality is all of us are prejudiced.  The atheist who declares "there is no God" is being prejudiced---that is what he has chosen to believe.  The Christian who asserts "there is a God" is being prejudiced--that is what he has chosen to believe.  Prejudice in itself is not the wrong...every person in the world has prejudices.  We cannot avoid them.

Relativity, i.e. any idea is valid--i.e. don't be prejudiced against anything, is the problem.  It is not wrong to believe differently or to have a different opinion.  It is wrong to demonstrate hatefulness towards those who think differently than you.
This is the root of a lot of the animosity people have demonstrated on this post.

There are objective truths, values, and yet at the same time each person must be persuaded in their own mind about what they believe.  We must respect each other's right to believe...as the Constitution of the U.S. declared.  I personally believe there are objective rights and wrongs.  I believe rape, murder, and such things are wrong.  Therefore I cannot support a rap artist who would publish those in a public medium so as to almost make them seem okay or at least normal.  Even the more artistic, cleaner forms of rap I find troubling, not pleasing, so I don't listen to it.  That's my personal preference.

That is my choice and I have a right to that choice.  But I do not condemn the person who chooses differently.  I might strive to share with them the reasons for my beliefs--if I didn't, would you respect my belief?  No, because when we truly believe something, we want to share it, in fact, we are willing to suffer for it. 

That is what this forum is all about.  People hashing out what they believe, sharing different opinions.

Let's support that spirit and refrain from bashing each other over our differences.

ame

[mikeyg]

do you think i would be on this thread if i wasn't looking for trouble?  com mon.

You take on Husky, you take on da mikester

[mikeyg]

And I like how all the violence on PF is focused in the rap thread...

[Torp]

Common-" i used to love her"- a story about a man who lost his love

I looked up the lyrics to all the songs you listed.  Man, that's some powerful stuff.

The lyrics for "I used to love her" struck me as being very metaphorical.  It seemed that the 'love' that has been lost, though written as if about a woman, was really about the corporatization of Hip Hop.  It was interesting how that does not become clear until the final lines of the song.  It changes dramatically the perception one has of the lyrics.  Of course, if you didn't listen to the whole song you'd just think it was only about a woman.

Good stuff, thanks.

Jef

[Siberian Husky]

this is true..this song can be used metaphorically for hip hop as a whole..but his intentions for writing it were for a woman he "lost" as she fell prey to the industry...but yes man..powerful

[i_m_robot]

ok.  give us a rap that incorporates einsteins E=mc2 and uses the word self many times.

ps no violence or sexual innuendos.  just plain science and music mixed with a lot of self-indulgence.  (wonders what this will do to the listeners?)  ok.  you can add a little bit of robot moves.  >>
             <<
              >>

ps. do i dare ask this question?  my daughter listens to a song entitled 'holla back, girl.'  now, my three year old is jiving to this.  what does it all mean?  she already hollers back.  will she be a rap artist later for being allowed to hear her sister's music (wanted her to be a pianist like me )

 

been there

done that

selfs listenen listenen hear all the dissenen

seem like rap haters are all on a missionin

not realisin the truth behind the hate

that it carries no weight

buts just done for the sake

to  feel superior inside

and theyre all trying to hide

but they cant escape

cuz the truth is too great

for them to contemplate

cuz the truth is:

https://www.sptimes.com/2004/04/24/Columns/Diversity_train_rolls.shtml (hah random fact)

to be continued...

[ako]

yeah nice class


but 4 components?..this is a nice broad view..but if you want to get in depth..theres also street poetry..spoken word..there are several TYPES of dances..boogaloo..poppin, lockin, and the infamous "breakdancing" or bboyin...Dj's can range from house DJs to old school hip hop DJs..afrika bambaataa was one DJ who really hazed the solid lines between hip hop culture music...MCing..or better known as "rapping"..can be from battles..to freestyles..to spoken words..to music writing..mind you..a freestyler and a music making MC are two different styles and worlds than can sometimes be meshed together...



ahhh..its a vast world out there..hip hop that is..its just so sad that people are so stuck up and ignorant to allow the media to spoonfeed them what things are like....AKA Eminem and 50 cent..

It's a course focusing on reading/writing. The hip hop is one component so he did not go into depth. So the information is quite broad. He also teaches another course that specifically focuses on hip hop. I'm sure there will be much more information there.

He himself did DJ and dance when he was younger. 

[i_m_robot]

yes

and this makes him ignorant, course, brutish, and less than human

[pianonut]

i-m-robot - you are a pretty good rapper, i must say.  what bothers me, though, is just what ame said.  you don't get the feeling from rap music that there is a peaceful solution to problems.  it just sort of messes with your brain to say that there is no absolute truth and our feelings are our only guide. this makes for the pointing and glaring into the camera to make a point.  if classical pianists did this, they would be considered snobbish. 

ps why don't they pull up their pants?

[jonjon]

I still consider RAP as music - actually, the least kind of music.  At least, it still has some element of music like tempo, beat, and rhythm.

[Siberian Husky]

I still consider RAP as music - actually, the least kind of music.  At least, it still has some element of music like tempo, beat, and rhythm.

i didnt get the memo on the musical hierarchy..hmm..maybe cause i didnt put those new cover sheets on the TPS reports..oh well..see you at the office Jonathan

[i_m_robot]

I still consider RAP as music - actually, the least kind of music.  At least, it still has some element of music like tempo, beat, and rhythm.

oh yeah

so what do call this https://www.lubomyr.com/

[Ruro]

oh yeah

so what do call this https://www.lubomyr.com/

¬_¬ Excuse my arrogance, but I am slightly dissapointed. Alright, I have just heard a total of 10 minutes of this style of music.... but never ending piano keys to create pretty pieces, although very nice, I swear I have heard in the Fairy Fountains on Zelda: Ocarina Of Time and even perhaps the City of the Zoras :/

I was expecting something absolutely amazing, but instead dished never ending, yet musically nice notes. Sorry, I guess with your few words, I somehow interpretted a revolution in piano music that was to draw in most of the worlds population :/ I just swear this isn't anything to be head over heels with (like the site seems to incite so much), since no one's jaws dropped over music in the Zelda game

And to make this a valid post, I don't mind Rap music... saw Snoop Dogg on Live 8 (Yup, he was in England and not America?), but he swore plentiful on live TV before the 8pm watershed! I pondered if that what legal... ^_^;;
Unless Rap music is expressing the deepest of emotional power and anger or something, I do fail to see the use of swear words which only incites the new generation full of hideous words. They should use there "bling" and create new swear words, effectively they won't be swearing since they came out of nowhere. (Oh, and new insulting hand gestures that make absolutely no sense).

[i_m_robot]

I was expecting something absolutely amazing, but instead dished never ending, yet musically nice notes. Sorry, I guess with your few words, I somehow interpretted a revolution in piano music that was to draw in most of the worlds population :/ I just swear this isn't anything to be head over heels with (like the site seems to incite so much), since no one's jaws dropped over music in the Zelda game

the point wasnt to present a massively stupid expressive form of music but something that has less variation than rap but is still considered good -even if only by a few

its perfect for napping to

[goansongo]

Some of you guys here are too narrowminded.  You're listening to the wrong kind of music and generalizing everything from what you hear.  Just because you hear a few bad rap songs, a few bad pop songs, or a few bad rock songs, doesn't make the whole genre bad.  Face it, as pianists, we've heard some crap classical music too. 

I admit that some of the music of rap, rock, and pop is trash, but that doesn't go for everything.  Rappers don't always rap about how many ho's they've banged or how much bling they have, or how cool their spinning rims are.  Hip-hop especially, which is very different from rap, gives out a message.  You need to stop listening to the mainstream stuff and generalizing your ideas like that.  If you don't believe me, listen to Nas or Immortal Technique.  Here's a link with the lyrics to one of Immortal Technique's songs, "Dance with the Devil" https://www.seeklyrics.com/lyrics/Immortal-Technique/Dance-With-the-Devil.html ...  And hey, this song even has piano in it.  The piano is playing the song "Where do I Begin aka Love Story Theme" as he "raps." 

Whoever started this topic is either really old or just really outdated.  People today don't just listen to Britney Spears and Justin Timberlake.  There are so many different genres of music now that it's just ignorant to say that classical and christian music is the only kind of music.  Yeah, piano music is more calm and soothing (usually), but it can't do what songs do.  Songs portray a message that most people can get just by listening to the song or by reading the lyrics.  In classical music, because there are no words or singing (and I'm not including opera) the "message" isn't really apparent to the average person.  Songs also tell a story.  I'm sure classical music pieces tell a story too, but again, it's not an obvious "story" that the average listener would get.

It just doesn't make sense to say rap/pop/anything else is not music.  Look up "music" in a dictionary.  You get "The art of arranging sounds in time so as to produce a continuous, unified, and evocative composition, as through melody, harmony, rhythm, and timbre. "  Just because you don't like that kind of music, doesn't mean it's not music.  It's just ignorant to believe that.  The ones against rap, you're probably old, as in you're more than 30 years old or something, so you probably listen to the wrong things.  Don't generalize when the only thing you've heard is the mainstream stuff like Britney Spears, Snoops Dogg, or whoever the heck you're listening to on the radio.  Do a little more research and stop watching BET and looking for people like Ludacris to support your idea that all rap sucks.

And don't be offended when you read this.  I'm focusing on the main topic, not the actual people that have left comments on this topic.  And if you're still offended, well...  You shouldn't be...  Be more open minded or something.

[larse]

As for talent, not many self-proclaimed musicians have it, and it probably have been this way since the dawn of time. The good news is, only those who are really good will place their mark on the history of music. Nobody in the year 2100 is going to listen to Britney Spears,  nor will they listen to anything from the redicolous avant-garde experimentaton era. But bands such as Deep Purple, or the Beatles will probably remain in the popular music repertoire forever, just like old songs such as Sawanee River are popular today.

I'm just answering to this...because. music being popular don't make it good music. I have loads of friends that don't play music. And I played a jazz record for some of them once. Like Minds with names like Gary Burton, Chick Corea and Pat Metheny. One of the greatest records of all time, but they hated it. People I know who do alot of music worship amongst other this album. So...if popular music is good music, 'bad' (as I would sday) musicians (i.e. Britney Spears) would be considered good artists.

What history has left us with great composers is very selective and often not very true. Luigi Cherubini is a good example on this. He is not very much remembered today. However, at the time he lived he was considered one of the best composers in the world. Worshiped by, amogst others, Beethoven. But we remember Beethoven as one of the greatest composers ever to have lived..

"Rediculous avant-garde experiments", is the music of today. You know, they said the same thing about Beethoven. When he wrote i.e. Op. 111 people thought he was mad. that is also the case with todays "classical" music. I also think lots of what's being produced today are...crap. but lots are great works. As in every other epoque the world has gone through...I also think that, if all of these enormous musicians..geniouses a lot of them, are working with this..how can it be, that it's crap..? Learn it, don't reject it. You might find it nice in the end.

I also just want to..

Christian music?`What the **** is that?

[dave santino]

Personally, I don't see any appeal in rap, and like many people, don't really consider it music, BUT I would never take away a person's right to listen to rap, or any other music, simply because I don't like it.

[silvaone]

Siberian Husky I must omcmend you on that brilliant display of roasting you did - using ''scholars'' such as Common and Atmosphere (God Loves Ugly ) as brilliant examples of how beautiful rap can be when not destroyed by the media

[Siberian Husky]

"God loves you guys...dont ever f*cking question that"

OH MY GOD IS THAT A SWEAR WORD?!..HEAVENS NO!!

[V Queen]

Some of you guys here are too narrowminded.  You're listening to the wrong kind of music and generalizing everything from what you hear.  Just because you hear a few bad rap songs, a few bad pop songs, or a few bad rock songs, doesn't make the whole genre bad.  Face it, as pianists, we've heard some crap classical music too. 

I admit that some of the music of rap, rock, and pop is trash, but that doesn't go for everything.  Rappers don't always rap about how many ho's they've banged or how much bling they have, or how cool their spinning rims are.  Hip-hop especially, which is very different from rap, gives out a message.  You need to stop listening to the mainstream stuff and generalizing your ideas like that.  If you don't believe me, listen to Nas or Immortal Technique.  Here's a link with the lyrics to one of Immortal Technique's songs, "Dance with the Devil" https://www.seeklyrics.com/lyrics/Immortal-Technique/Dance-With-the-Devil.html ...  And hey, this song even has piano in it.  The piano is playing the song "Where do I Begin aka Love Story Theme" as he "raps." 

Whoever started this topic is either really old or just really outdated.  People today don't just listen to Britney Spears and Justin Timberlake.  There are so many different genres of music now that it's just ignorant to say that classical and christian music is the only kind of music.  Yeah, piano music is more calm and soothing (usually), but it can't do what songs do.  Songs portray a message that most people can get just by listening to the song or by reading the lyrics.  In classical music, because there are no words or singing (and I'm not including opera) the "message" isn't really apparent to the average person.  Songs also tell a story.  I'm sure classical music pieces tell a story too, but again, it's not an obvious "story" that the average listener would get.

It just doesn't make sense to say rap/pop/anything else is not music.  Look up "music" in a dictionary.  You get "The art of arranging sounds in time so as to produce a continuous, unified, and evocative composition, as through melody, harmony, rhythm, and timbre. "  Just because you don't like that kind of music, doesn't mean it's not music.  It's just ignorant to believe that.  The ones against rap, you're probably old, as in you're more than 30 years old or something, so you probably listen to the wrong things.  Don't generalize when the only thing you've heard is the mainstream stuff like Britney Spears, Snoops Dogg, or whoever the heck you're listening to on the radio.  Do a little more research and stop watching BET and looking for people like Ludacris to support your idea that all rap sucks.

And don't be offended when you read this.  I'm focusing on the main topic, not the actual people that have left comments on this topic.  And if you're still offended, well...  You shouldn't be...  Be more open minded or something.

yes THANK YOU. I almost killed myself when I read the first post, it's unbelievable how ignorant and closed minded some people can be.

[pianote]

the first post... talk about ignorance ...

all forms of music is still music. I enjoy rap, punk, rock, hip-hop, classical- etc. etc.

rather than say that rap isn't music why don't you just say that you don't understand rap?
there's a difference between disliking the lyrics and saying that it isn't music.

...wow.

[i_m_robot]

um yeah

if rap is music then self is really a 6'3 black guy with and IQ of 154 and zero piano talent

*sighs and lowers head*

*raises head*

but we all know that self is a 3'3 french-asian five-year-old with mad piano skillz 

https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php/topic,10605.0.html

[clef]

What's your view on the current music in our world?  I think all the music like POP, Rock, Rap, and any other form of stupidity called music come up by music morons is all crap.  I hate listening to all this crap, yes crap.

It's an embarassment when we look at how far we humans have come, and then to see that we idolize some high-school drop out who talks about raping his mother and killing his wife and other people.

Just for the record, Rap IS NOT Music, it has never been music and never will be music.  When you have a thug saying something that only the morons in society understand, and he doesn't even sing in it, how can you call that music?

I'm just voicing my hate for Rap and all the other crap in the world, it makes me sick to turn on the TV and watch Entertainment Tonight show some high school dropout moron who's moronic CD just went Platinum.

And then you see all these wonderful and talented Pianist's, who are struggling to jump start their career after a lifetime of hard work and dedication.

It's a big downside to us as humans.

Rap makes you more stupid, psychotic, and crazy.

Piano music makes you more smart, calm and intelligent.

My choice for music is Contemporary Christian, Classical, etc. I enjoy some very talented artists like Michael W. Smith, and others, because they dont' turn their music into something out-of-this-world-crap.  

But everything else in the world, all these no-talented Britney's and Justin's are a disgrace to the word music itself.  

I agree with you and disagree with you there. 

First off i think you wrote this message way to spontaneously and haven't put much thought into it.  I agree with this part

"It's an embarassment when we look at how far we humans have come, and then to see that we idolize some high-school drop out who talks about raping his mother and killing his wife and other people. Just for the record, Rap IS NOT Music, it has never been music and never will be music.  When you have a thug saying something that only the morons in society understand, and he doesn't even sing in it, how can you call that music?

I'm just voicing my hate for Rap and all the other crap in the world, it makes me sick to turn on the TV and watch Entertainment Tonight show some high school dropout moron who's moronic CD just went Platinum."

and this part

"It's an embarassment when we look at how far we humans have come, and then to see that we idolize some high-school drop out who talks about raping his mother and killing his wife and other people.

Just for the record, Rap IS NOT Music, it has never been music and never will be music.  When you have a thug saying something that only the morons in society understand, and he doesn't even sing in it, how can you call that music?"

I dont like rap and i agree that you can't call it music, but "pop and rock" is a very broad genre, and number of genres, it is like when some idiot calls classical music any music writting from the dawn of time to 70 years ago, it works both ways.  You can't realy say that all contempoary popular music is #$%^  although i will give it to you that more then enogh of it is, most of it is not.  It does disturb me when some idiot who got through Australian idol, who barley has any sight reading talent becomes one of the most famous people in the world, where there are many proffesional singers getting diplomas in music, and who sound heaps better, and are much more versitle get no credit at all, the world should be interested more in real talent, in real musicians and vocalists. 

[mr. folsom]

Hate the artist, not the artform.

Most peoples' first impression of rap music comes from what they happen to hear on the radio or tv (what big-time execs who have know connection to the true art form want to sell, They have their reasons). Likewise, most peoples' first impression of classical music may come from a commercial, the background music of some event (where there's most likely to be a generic interpretation, crappy arrangement etc.), or from a snob telling them that the music they're currently listening to is crap (where the snob would commence to make some fluffy argument, replacing facts with subjectivity).

Anyway people who like rap or classical have at least three things in common:

1) They each have a natural inclination to that artform.
2) The type music is met with encouragement  from a social surrounding (however small that social surrounding may be).
3) They have taken the time to learn about the music they love, it history it's components, it's possibilities, it's masters...

The only difference between someone who exclusively likes clasical music and one who soley likes classical - now mind you it's unlikely that some one will have an exclusive taste, this is just an example - is that they havent applied the third similarity they share to the type of music. Sure someone who likses rap isn't going to like everything of classical in time and vice versa, but nobody who likes classical (no matter how much they like it), loves EVERYTHING within that field of art. So, considering our two individuals with their limited tastes in music, it is possble for them to learn to appreciate eachother's music tastes, provided that there is a sincere attempt to understand them. It's happened before. For either case I must repeat some sage advice i heard in this discussion: Some people will have to take their heads out their asses.

(Oh yeah, please don't think that I'm trying that everyone should love all types of music. Everyone has the right to dislike what they want for good reason. I'm just saying that it appears that some judgements are premature, stemming from limited knowledge.)

BTW: the definition of "music " in this discussion has had quite the enthocentric application, wouldn't you say??

[tompilk]

I hate rap and I don't understand how people can like it, but if people get enjoyment from it, and it doesn't hurt the rest of us, let them listen! It is not music and I would do anything to get away from it - and I detest people playing it loudly in cars with windows open> they should have more respect for other people... anyway, i don't think that there are many people at my school who listen to classical - maybe me only!!! Anyway, they probably moan about people like us - thinking we're all posh, but we know and dislike their music choice back.
Let them do what they want, so we can do what we want...

[sportsmonster]

try rapping to a piano piece.
It sounds like someone of the audience is disturbing in the background while you are trying to play. like dad yelling in the phone beside the piano when you play. very beutiful.

[allthumbs]

I agree with the premise of this thread that Rap is not music. At best it is antisocial, misogynistic, racist and violent drivel, 'performed' (and I use that term rather loosely) for the most part by untalented people who don't know anything about music. 

It rates right up there with the 'skinhead' white supremacy music that was around a few years ago.

I call it "Rapcrap" period . End of story.

IMO.

Cheers

allthumbs

[Siberian Husky]

I agree with the premise of this thread that Rap is not music. At best it is antisocial, misogynistic, racist and violent drivel, 'performed' (and I use that term rather loosely) for the most part by untalented people who don't know anything about music. 

It rates right up there with the 'skinhead' white supremacy music that was around a few years ago.

I call it "Rapcrap" period . End of story.

IMO.

Cheers

allthumbs

end of story? LOL you think you just served us all a justice with your arrogant audacious display of ignorance?...you just made your argument (entire first paragraph) on entirely false premises..thus leaving you with a piece of *** leg to stand on..THUS making you just another face in the croud of conclusion jumping uneducated judgemental self righteous band wagoners..

violent when performed?..all you seen was rap on MTV...you couldnt differentiate between a commercial rapper and a hip hopper to save your life..if you could..you'd see that theres a night and day difference to the media's portrayal of rap and and rap's true authenticity...and dont bother quoting me back or responding to my views..becauyse from the read through of your quick mediocre immature post, you'v clearly shown me than you didnt even read through the 4 pages and simply responded with head in your ass to what you believe to be so...but all that was induced was your tainted opinion on something you now nothing of...your nothing special..your just another statistic in life's melting pot of prejudice...if you do take the path of arguing a valid point..do us all a favor by reading thoroughly, especially the several posts i'v made in this thread

i base my argument and standpoint on logic and support my opinions with examples, facts, and proof...you wouldnt like it if someone trashed your mother for being a bad person simply because people misinterpret her low-brow disposition for a bitchy and rude character,..for the record..this is an analogy and is to be taken with a grain of salt...dont take it up the ass but i am putting your own self through a different perspective so that you can identify your misjudgement...

[stevie]

husky, he had to be kidding...i mean noone is really that stupid...are they?

[chopiabin]

i-m-robot - you are a pretty good rapper, i must say.  what bothers me, though, is just what ame said.  you don't get the feeling from rap music that there is a peaceful solution to problems.  it just sort of messes with your brain to say that there is no absolute truth and our feelings are our only guide. this makes for the pointing and glaring into the camera to make a point.  if classical pianists did this, they would be considered snobbish. 

ps why don't they pull up their pants?

When did it become an absolute truth that there is a peaceful solution to every problem? The reason why they are saying that there is no absolute truth is that they, and much of America, do not believe in its existence.

And maybe they don't want to pull up their pants. Why doesn't Kissin cut his hair? Why don't pianists stop making dumb faces while they're playing?

[chopiabin]

I agree with the premise of this thread that Rap is not music. At best it is antisocial, misogynistic, racist and violent drivel, 'performed' (and I use that term rather loosely) for the most part by untalented people who don't know anything about music. 

It rates right up there with the 'skinhead' white supremacy music that was around a few years ago.

I call it "Rapcrap" period . End of story.

IMO.

Cheers





allthumbs

Yeah. You just lost every bit of respect I may have ever had for you on this forum.



Who are you people? You act like you're so high-minded just because you listen to music written a few hundred years ago. If you all hold up "true" art in such high regard, then how the hell can you be so shallow-minded and not even respect art enough to research something before proclaiming it trash? Judging rap based on popular music is like judging classical music based on Yanni -  it's complete bullshit.

And to all the people who are like, "I hate rap music because it promotes immorality. They have bad words!!!," I can only say: GROW UP!!!!!

Remember that guy Elvis? Remember how people hated him becasue he gyrated his hips and sung "black" music? Yeah. You're all acting just the same.

So many of the things said in this thread are just thinly veiled racist comments. What the hell?! This thread pisses me off so much!!

[randmc]

I've read some of the previous post in this thread and I'd just like to say, *YOUR ALL VERY, VERY, VERY, IGNORANT! (*with the exception of SiberianHusky and a few others.) IMO, alot of you are basing your very 'ignorant' opinions on your prejudice or hatred of the African-American culture. Some people call it hatred, I like to call it racism.

I also noticed alot of you saying that the basis of todays music is Classical music. WRONG. Technically, jazz, pop, rap, r&b, blues, alternative, rock, punk rock, classical, romantic, baroque, new age, etc., derives from African music. <--or as some of you would say, 'noise pollution'.

Alot of you are also saying that you hate rap music. You and it hasn't even been around long enough for ANYBODY to hate it.

SiberianHusky, you are right. Alot of these people are only making comments based on what they see on tv or hear on the radio. Most of rap is not about sex, guns, lies, drugs, or video tapes. Most of rap is about peoples feelings or self. Alot of you are stripping rap down to the bare minimum (i.e. saying that its only beats and noise), when infact it is not. It is music carefully placed with lyrics to make songs. I do admit, SOME, but not most, of rap has vulgar lyrics and talks about inappropiate things.

And just to note, there is a difference between opinions and judgements. Most of you are making judgements.

So before you all start passing out judgements like parking tickets in New York, research your topic, and present valid information to this thread.

[allthumbs]

husky, he had to be kidding...

  Bingo.

It just goes to show what violent reactions one can illicit when a viewpoint, however tongue-in-cheek it may have been, is presented.

Peace

allthumbs

[chopiabin]

Sorry about that, but, considering some of the other posts, I wouldn't have been surprised if you had been serious.

Maybe I shouldn't be so angry, but I just really despise ignorant, arrogant people posing as intellectuals.