Poll for religious people

[ggc]

.

[leucippus]

I wasn't aware that religious people needed anyone else to make them look bad. 

[cziffra]

hahaha, no speak up

[maul]

Religion makes religious people look bad.

[ahinton]

It's early days yet for the poll results to arrive, of course - but what will we do if more than one person votes "I am pianistimo"? Will we then get into that old situation of "I'm Spartacus"?...

Seriously, though - MUST we have such a poll as this? I suppose that, if it eventually brings into proper perspective what a majority of active forum members feel about expressions of religiosity in forum posts irrespective of thread topic, then it may come to acquire some really useful purpose. Let's wait and see...

Best,

Alistair

[quantum]

I am religious.  Pianistimo just likes to talk about it, nothing wrong with that. 

I have come across much scarier religious people, and religions with strange beliefs. 

[mikey6]

I believe in God but I don't never bring religion into conversation as it's as bad as discussing politics!
It seems even some members from here have deserted us to join dasdc and have started a post about the amount of religious whining that goes on here!

[counterpoint]

pianistimo is such a nice person

and nothing is wrong with religion, as long as it is not misused to justify war

[ada]

Religion makes religious people look bad.

That's not true. There are plenty of sensible religious people, christians included. Pianistimo, aka the PF god(warrior), is in a class of her own though.

She deserves a medal for services in promoting christianity as a relevant, credible and attractive belief system. God couldn't ask for a better ambassador, could he?

[thalbergmad]

She deserves a medal for services in promoting christianity as a relevant, credible and attractive belief system. God couldn't ask for a better ambassador, could he?

Errrrrr, yes.

Thal

[leucippus]

and nothing is wrong with religion, as long as it is not misused to justify war

Unfortuantely it is misused for that all the time.

Not only that but it's also the basis for predjudice and bigamy.

Not saying that's true for religious individuals so much, but unfortunately it seems to have that affect on the masses in general.

[ahinton]

That's not true. There are plenty of sensible religious people, christians included. Pianistimo, aka the PF god(warrior), is in a class of her own though.

She deserves a medal for services in promoting christianity as a relevant, credible and attractive belief system. God couldn't ask for a better ambassador, could he?

God couldn't - er, what about "God DIDN'T"?

There are indeed plenty of sensible religious people, but the kind of "ambassadorial" writing we often get from susanistimo might just put people off adding to their number...

I really have no doubt that she means well; I just happen to think, nevetheless, that the prospect of her God jumping out from every black key, every piano hammer, every damper and every wrest pin on this fourm to assault me with the kind of "Ada, Chapter 2, Verse 1" (sorry!) with which most of us are all too distressingly familiar is just too much, frankly...

God moves in a mysterious way
His wonders to perform;
To Susan's God-promotion, though
I find I just can't warm.

Breathe on me, breath of God -
But use some mouthwash first;
Pianistimoselytising rants
Are up there with the worst.

God be in my head
Despite misunderstanding;
From Susan's red-hot gospelling
Pray(!) give me a soft landing.

God the Father, God the Son
And God the Holy Ghost -
Yet if you miss all three, you'll still
Get Pianistimo-sed

Yours tiredly (it's late here)

Alistair

[pianistimo]

somehow, coming from you, alistair - i take this as a sort of love poem of sorts.  maybe a love-hate poem.  you're the first to come up with this genre.  to spend so much visible effort. 

i must say again - that i merely answer posts about God and do not start them.  i have a track record of just jumping in whenever anyone has a question about the bible or about something.  but, imo, i am only responding and not soliciting in that sense.

today, i thank God for Thanksgiving.  and, for not letting the turkey burn.  and, basically for a whole 'nuther' year with no major catastrophes.  i say - count your blessings!  happy turkey day - to anyone who had one.  susan

[ramseytheii]

I am glad that this post, which started as a surprising offensive on the benign pianitisimo, instead turned into a celebration of her particular talents.  There is another forum I freqeutnly read called Sequenza21, a community for composers, and the negative energy on that site is oppressive.  PianoForum has always been refreshing because the people are so supportive of each other, without selling their own opinions short.  Congratulations on all who avoided the "mob mentality" and gave pianitisimo her dues!

Walter Ramsey

[pianistimo]

thanks, ramseytheii!  hey. someone voted as me.  there's now two.  how did this happen?

[pianowolfi]

It seems even some members from here have deserted us to join dasdc and have started a post about the amount of religious whining that goes on here!

Yes, but I was going to defend this forum as you may have noticed.

[jre58591]

haha apparently we have 3 pianistimos here. its an invasion!!!!

[wishful thinker]

will the real Pianistimo, please stand up?

maybe Pianistimo is a sort of unholy trinity?  Pianistimo the mother, pianistimo the child and Pianistimo the holy cr*p? 

But will any of them rise to the challenge and pick up the gauntlet that Mr Hinton has thrown down?

[pianowolfi]

haha apparently we have 3 pianistimos here. its an invasion!!!!

Yes, as I suspected she has a company. All employees of that company call themselves "Pianistimo". That's the brand name.

[ahinton]

somehow, coming from you, alistair - i take this as a sort of love poem of sorts.  maybe a love-hate poem.  you're the first to come up with this genre.  to spend so much visible effort.

I'm not sure that it is - or that I have - and I assure you that this took less than two minutes...

i must say again - that i merely answer posts about God and do not start them.  i have a track record of just jumping in whenever anyone has a question about the bible or about something.  but, imo, i am only responding and not soliciting in that sense.

You can say it again if you "must" - and indeed you have done so - but you had no need to do this, since there has already been an exchange on this very matter between you and Thal in which he agreed that you do not actually start posts about this kind of thing but also observed that you have a habit of bringing it into almost eveything that you post here. I agree that you are responding and not "soliciting" (a term which has an additional quite different meaning in British English!), but what you do - oh so frequently - is drag your beliefs, Biblical quotations and the rest into threads that are not about such matters.

today, i thank God for Thanksgiving.  and, for not letting the turkey burn.

Who cooked the turkey? You? If so, then thank youself for not letting it burn!

and, basically for a whole 'nuther' year with no major catastrophes.

...and with how many posts?!...

i say - count your blessings!

...and I say - count your posts!...

happy turkey day - to anyone who had one.  susan

We don't do Thanksgiving over here; that's a particularly American thing to do, as you probably already know. I'm glad you have had a good one, though.

Best,

Alistair

[ahinton]

haha apparently we have 3 pianistimos here.

Does that make pppppp? How pathetic! (as in a dynamic marking to be found in Tchaikovsky's Sixth Symphony)...

its an invasion!!!!

No change there, then...

Best,

Alistair

[wishful thinker]

We don't do Thanksgiving over here; that's a particularly American thing to do

Presumably not if one was a native American?

[ahinton]

Presumably not if one was a native American?

Nor, indeed, if one was a non-American living in America. Point taken. My statement would better have read that Thanksgiving is something particularly celebrated in America, thereby removing the risk of politically incorrect interpretation!

Best,

Alistair

[ahinton]

haha apparently we have 3 pianistimos here. its an invasion!!!!

Question for Nils and/or anyone else here that may know:

Is it possible for "pianistimo" to have voted "I am pianistimo" three times or is there something in the way that the polling facility is set up here that prevents such abuse of members' voting powers?

It must be understood, however, that the above question is posed on the strict understanding that no suggestion is made thereby that "pianistimo" has done, has tried to do or would want to do any such thing...

Best,

Alistair

[ahinton]

this post, which started as a surprising offensive on the benign pianitisimo

To be fair, I do not believe that it did so - or at least not in any overt sense, in that neither the thread topic itself nor the originator's first post in the thread even mentions her name, or indeed any individual's name, for that matter; your view of the thread as being
"a surprising offensive on the benign pianitisimo"
is therefore arrived at by association alone.

Best,

Alistair

[ramseytheii]

To be fair, I do not believe that it did so - or at least not in any overt sense, in that neither the thread topic itself nor the originator's first post in the thread even mentions her name, or indeed any individual's name, for that matter; your view of the thread as being
"a surprising offensive on the benign pianitisimo"
is therefore arrived at by association alone.

Best,

Alistair

That is really splitting hairs.  "Question:  Does pianistimo make religious people look bad?" is the first thing anybody sees when they open the dang article.  Anyways, post on, pianitisimo!

Walter Ramsey

[wishful thinker]

Anyways, post on, pianitisimo!

This is highly probably, my friend, especially as we now have four Pianistimos (or should that be Pianistimi?) 

She seems to be mutliplying at a somewhat alarming rate 

[jpianoflorida]

so I should pick one of the nonbelievers on the forum and say "DOES _____________ make all atheists look bad?"  I really don't see the point of this thread at all.   It really does disrespect to everyone.

[wishful thinker]

Well, I don't agree with the athiests (obviously), but I do respect the way that they do some research and try to agrue logically (thereby missing the entire point of religion).

Some of the "Christians" on the other hand have no better argument than "it says so in the Bible".  That is not an argument against someone that does believe in the Bible in the first place, and usually leads that person to ever more ridiculous statements as they counter specific contradicitions in the Bible or their own argument.

So yes, I do think that certain "Chrisitians" are giving Christianity a bad name, especially when their grasp of fundamental theology is so shaky. 

[pianistimo]

there are now four of me.  i can vouch for only voting for myself once - as the first time - i was going to ignore the thread completely to see what would happen. 

now, if i were not arguing at least halfway decent - noone would be talking to me right now.  they'd all be ignoring me.  but, i have had responses from the threads of which this thread refers and quite long extensive arguments for each side - that does have a certain amount of visible thought and effort (even for a stupid person like me).

for instance, i brought up the issue of the tides.  if the moon and sun and space is ever expanding and pulling away from the earth - how come the tides are fairly constant (still)  and how come there are people such as mr. vail who gives tours in the grand canyon (who USED to be, btw, a regular evolutionist and explained for years the grand canyon in those terms) who suddenly began to see anomolies in the grand canyon that would be accounted for by a worldwide flood fairly recently in world history.  for instance some of the rock layers are completely and utterly flat (as a table) indicating a lot of weight and sediment that was forced down.  also, layers that are bent all together (many layers) indicating that whatever happened could have been done fairly quickly and not over 'millions' of years.  also, fossil records show that a catastrophe of some kind happened to fix the fish and all that are found in position in the middle of sediment. 

now, if i happen to believe in God and you all don't - what is it to you?  i am simply arguing the other side.  in the usa - we have first ammendment right to speak our mind - but slowly it seems that world law and conditions mean that Christians have no right to have a view and evolutionists have every right to promote THEORY.  that is the theory.  now, i'm not saying that i don't read science textbooks or things on internet related to recent studies. i think they are all well and good.  but, i take everything with a grain of salt - just as some of you do the bible.  who of you can prove these 'million' and billions of different ages.  and who of you can prove that no two textbooks are really similar when it comes to all the details (unless written by the same author or researcher - or copied from a similar source).

[wishful thinker]

QED 

[ahinton]

there are now four of me.

I am having a so far insurmountable problem just trying to convince one of you...

now, if i happen to believe in God and you all don't - what is it to you?

But this is not correct - and you already know this; you are by no means the only member of this forum who believes in God - not even the only Christian here who does, either - but that is, quite simply, not the point at issue here.

i am simply arguing the other side.

We all know the particular position from which you argue; that is not the point at issue here, either.

in the usa - we have first ammendment right to speak our mind - but slowly it seems that world law and conditions mean that Christians have no right to have a view and evolutionists have every right to promote THEORY.

This raises two issues. Firstly, not every member of this forum is subject to the laws and constitution of the United States of America. Secondly - and far more importantly - the purpose of the First Amendment to the American constitution was and is the granting of freedom of expression to American citizens; it was and is not to grant to those American citizens the inalienable right to speak their minds at all times irrespective of whether what they say at any given moment bears any relevance to the subject under discussion - in other words, it grants you the right to hold and express your particular Christian beliefs but not to proselytise and preach at other people who may or may not share them, especially when those others are discussing different subjects altogether.

Please can you try to understand that - and also to recognise that many people discussing non-religious topics do not want their discussions intruded upon and interrupted bu religious preaching and citations?

Best,

Alistair

[ahinton]

That is really splitting hairs.  "Question:  Does pianistimo make religious people look bad?" is the first thing anybody sees when they open the dang article.  Anyways, post on, pianitisimo!

Walter Ramsey

Nice to have hairs to split! People do not see that question until they have opened the thread whose title makes no reference to "pianistimo" or any other individual; then they see the first post which does likewise. To be honest, I do not consider that my remark splits any more hairs that you do when persistently referring to "pianistimo" and "Pianitisimo"...

Best,

Alistair

[ggc]

To be fair, I do not believe that it did so - or at least not in any overt sense, in that neither the thread topic itself nor the originator's first post in the thread even mentions her name, or indeed any individual's name, for that matter; your view of the thread as being
"a surprising offensive on the benign pianitisimo"
is therefore arrived at by association alone.

Best,

Alistair

yes, I do think that certain "Chrisitians" are giving Christianity a bad name, especially when their grasp of fundamental theology is so shaky. 

A few statements:

I am a religious member of this forum, and I have used another username before this one (which I prefer not to disclose).

I am on the verge of losing my faith because of some of the overtly ridiculous and erroneous statements pianistimo has made in her posts.

The point of this poll is to seek closure as to whether or not other religious people of this forum support pianistimo's posts.

Unfortunately, I think atheists have confounded the results of this survey.

[pianistimo]

at least you are so kind to spell my name right - and you and ada give me the benefit of the doubt many times - even when i argue inaccurately at best.  but, what i do take issue with - is that when a thread is raised - a poll - to say - is she stupid or do you agree with me - i think it is quite insulting to then say  that i have no right to respond.

if you all are so smart and want to carry on in a way of knowledge that is superior - explain why wikipedia says this :  carbon 14 dating is accurate within a year up to 2000 year range.  (implying that beyond this and especially beyond 3000+ or - years - it becomes more and more inaccurate. 

from wikipedia (not me) :  "the carbon-14 method is not immune to grossly inaccurate  dating when non-apparent problems exist in the samples from the field.  the existence of indeterminate errors occurs FREQUENTLY.'

now - as i am not supposed to respond to any religious threads - i post my response here.  what better place to make yourselves look stupider than me.  which might happen in your lifetime - if Jesus Christ arrives.  if you call me stupid - and He's real --that means that you are stupider than stupid.  and, i'm not arguing the fact that i am no brain surgeon.

[pianistimo]

btw, there are now five of me.  try as you will - you simply cannot beat me.  ahahhaha.  and i'm stupid. 

**ps i only voted once, remember.  so that means that four people think they are ME.  what does that mean?  or, perhaps they want me to win.  in that case - i say they are smart.

oh.  and one more thing...i never said i was really smart in the first place.  so if you are having all these really detailed frustrations over discussion with me - you are really stupid for arguing with a stupid person.  ahahhahahahaha

you're really putting me over the edge now.  and you don't know how close i was before.  so that means - when i'm gone - you'll have noone to argue pointlessly about facts that are not facts.  we are just arguing speculation.  what is huge?  salvation!  for stupid people and smart people alike.  if God is full of wisdom - if i am stupid - He can straighten me out.  and, i try to listen as best i can now to anyone who proves that the universe is this way or that - but my basis will always be God's word. 

'the beginning of wisdom is the fear of the Lord...'

[ahinton]

what i do take issue with - is that when a thread is raised - a poll - to say - is she stupid or do you agree with me - i think it is quite insulting to then say  that i have no right to respond.

It certainly would be - but that is not - as far as I can tell - what this poll is supposed to be for; I don't see any accusation of stupidity in the poll text itself - do you?

now - as i am not supposed to respond to any religious threads - i post my response here.

May I presume you to have meant "non-religious threads"? If so, this statemtn would make more sense, except to say that no one is advocating that you do not post at all to non-religious threads - only that you don't contruibute vast swathes of religious verbiage when you do - that's all!

what better place to make yourselves look stupider than me.  which might happen in your lifetime - if Jesus Christ arrives.  if you call me stupid - and He's real --that means that you are stupider than stupid.  and, i'm not arguing the fact that i am no brain surgeon.

I am not calling you stupid. I am wondering if you can at times be intransigent, though, because you seem so often deliberately to misinterpret the pleas that I have made. I am no brain surgeon either.

Best,

Alistair

[ahinton]

'the beginning of wisdom is the fear of the Lord...'

The beginning of the end of wisdom is the fear of people who falsely think that they're "pianistimo".

That's four people to be fearful of, so far...

Best,

Alistair

[pianistimo]

leucippus voted the other four times.  do you know how i know.  because he used to write me these love poems.  but, now he is on the fence.  i love her - i love her not...  he jsut did this to counter his seemingly begrudging realization that even a person who attempts to 'schmooze' me is out of luck when it comes to changing my belief structure without a radical array of weapons to fight me with.

now, granted - he is smooth.  and, as far as he could tell - quite a tall and muscular man.  but, as i see it - david slung that stone right into the little crevace of the helmet of the giant and brought him down.

the reason people get so peeved about religion in a thread about how 'huge' space is - is because it really IS huge.  can they explain it.  why have we not found life on any other planet.  could it be there IS a God? shhhhhh.

[cfortunato]

Your poll is the very definition of bigotry.  To suggest that one member of the group makes a group look bad is bigotry.

Does Michael Jackson make black people look bad?

Does your bigotry make all non-religious people look bad?

[arensky]

A few statements:

I am a religious member of this forum, and I have used another username before this one (which I prefer not to disclose).

Yes. 

I am on the verge of losing my faith because of some of the overtly ridiculous and erroneous statements pianistimo has made in her posts.

The point of this poll is to seek closure as to whether or not other religious people of this forum support pianistimo's posts.

Unfortunately, I think atheists have confounded the results of this survey.

If someone posting in an internet forum is going to cause you to lose your faith then your faith was never very strong to begin with. Look to God (whatever that is for you) and away from here.

And what did you expect the atheists to do? 

[cziffra]

pianistimo doesn't make religious people look bad, she makes the whole of humanity semm like a failure

[lisztisforkids]

I find this poll mildly insulting.... I believe in God, but yet would you lump me in the same catergory as Pianisitimo?

[pianistimo]

you spelled my name wrong.  but i am not calling you an idiot because in the sight of God we're all equal.  you know - how some  people look for every little thing wrong in a person.  why not look for things you love about someone - and keep back the things you would criticize.

perhaps i should do this with hamelin - as i am now going to buy a cd to prove to someone that he plays chopin like a dead fish.  but, then i am comparing someone else to him (thiboudet sp?) and rather like what i heard and find it hard for anyone else to be just like him. 

but, if there are no comparisons - then each person is judged on their own merits and not by a certain 'yellow pencil' status.  you know - what they, individually, do the best.

[arensky]

you spelled my name wrong.  but i am not calling you an idiot because in the sight of God we're all equal.  you know - how some  people look for every little thing wrong in a person.  why not look for things you love about someone - and keep back the things you would criticize.

Good advice, often hard to follow when people are **********.

perhaps i should do this with hamelin - as i am now going to buy a cd to prove to someone that he plays chopin like a dead fish.  but, then i am comparing someone else to him (thiboudet sp?) and rather like what i heard and find it hard for anyone else to be just like him. 

Save your money. You don't want to go driving on the east coast today anyway. Just look here....

https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php/topic,21703.0.html

but, if there are no comparisons - then each person is judged on their own merits and not by a certain 'yellow pencil' status.  you know - what they, individually, do the best.

As it should be; but it's interesting to see why X's personal best is often considered to be superior to Y's by more people than others, and why people think one way or another. What a great way to learn, by comparing the greats (and not so greats), and we don't even have to leave our computer chair. Life is good... 

[jpianoflorida]

Your poll is the very definition of bigotry.  To suggest that one member of the group makes a group look bad is bigotry.

Does Michael Jackson make black people look bad?

Does your bigotry make all non-religious people look bad?

good point cfortunato!

[jpianoflorida]

pianistimo doesn't make religious people look bad, she makes the whole of humanity semm like a failure

can you exlplain what you mean exactly?

[ahinton]

I tell you what - here's a good idea (or at least I think so):

1. To all those who want to have a go at "pianistimo" - hands off her!
2. To "pianistimo": hands off the preaching / proselytising / Biblical citing, etc. in all threads on subjects that do not call for it and leave in peace those who don't want to hear it in irrelevant contexts

No go on, Susan - ignore my plea again, why don't you? - and instead extract my use of the term "peace" and go recontextualise it by wrapping around it the words "the (×××××) of God which passeth all understanding".

I sometimes wonder if your forum ID might be considered less than appropriate; "pianistimo" sounds, of course, like "pianissimo", yet your preaching has a forceful quality that would have to be marked fortissimo at the very least...

Best,

Alistair

[ahinton]

pianistimo doesn't make religious people look bad, she makes the whole of humanity semm like a failure

That is an unfair, unreasonable and, frankly untenably inflated claim. "Pianistimo" doesn't "make" anyone else look like anything. She makes herself look like a born-again Christian preacher that just won't let go of her preaching mission, regardless of the context within which she exercises it and almost equally regardless of whether it is appropriate or considerate to foist it upon the entire membership of a forum dedicated to matters pianistic rather than religious.

Best,

Alistair

[jre58591]

perhaps i should do this with hamelin - as i am now going to buy a cd to prove to someone that he plays chopin like a dead fish.  but, then i am comparing someone else to him (thiboudet sp?) and rather like what i heard and find it hard for anyone else to be just like him. 

actually hamelin hasnt released any chopin commercially, except for the 2nd sonata, and it doesnt quite measure up to the barcarolle or the ballades, which arent commercially recorded. save your money, watch the video, and find the non-commercial recs.