Who are some Romantic composers you can't stand?

[thalbergmad]

But well, one of my friends who is a quite good amateur pianist said to me "Either you like Liszt or Chopin, but not both"

Liszt is for men.

Chopin is for women and poofs.

Thal

[retrouvailles]

I can not stand Wagner. He was anti-semetic and as a jew a find it very disturbing. He was the Mel Gibson of classical music

Szymanowski was a pedophile, and Gesualdo was a murderer, but so what? Why should we let composers' personal lives influence how much we study and cherish their music? It shouldn't bother us at all, really, for many composers who were significant were also rather bad characters, but we shouldn't let that stop us from enjoying their music. It just seems silly.

[pianowolfi]

Liszt is for men.

Chopin is for women and poofs.

Thal

You....you.....mmmmpfhhhargghhhh  

 

[stevebob]

Szymanowski is known to have been a pederast, not a pedophile.

Wagner and Mel Gibson are both antisemites who experienced success and fame during their lifetimes, but I don't think they're of comparable talent and artistry.

Part of the Lisztian legend was that he made women swoon, so I'm not sure how Liszt would be for men.  And the last time I looked, "poofs" were men; I guess Chopin is for everyone, then. 

[thalbergmad]

Part of the Lisztian legend was that he made women swoon, so I'm not sure how Liszt would be for men.  And the last time I looked, "poofs" were men; I guess Chopin is for everyone, then. 

I was referring to the performer as opposed to the listener.

Thal

[mephisto]

Szymanowski was a pedophile, and Gesualdo was a murderer, but so what? Why should we let composers' personal lives influence how much we study and cherish their music? It shouldn't bother us at all, really, for many composers who were significant were also rather bad characters, but we shouldn't let that stop us from enjoying their music. It just seems silly.

Chopin doesn't seam to be have been a very nice humanbeing either.

When that is said, I would be delighted for anyone here to point out a single composer who died before 1900 who said that all people are born equal regardless of their religion or ethnicity. I am not saying that they don't exist, but I haven't found one yet (not that I have searched that much),

About the topic: Well I like many of the composers Thalbergmad like, but to be honest many of them aren't really that interesting musically. They are fun but not really very deep.

[stevebob]

I was referring to the performer as opposed to the listener.

Thal

Thanks for clarifying, but, as I said, "poofs" (whether performers or listeners) are men.  Obviously, performers of any gender can excel at performing Chopin's music.  Is it true, though, that female pianists have no affinity for Liszt?

[synthex]

?

[thalbergmad]

Is it true, though, that female pianists have no affinity for Liszt?

Cannot think of any incredible Liszt performances by women pianists at the moment, but my mind is struggling to concentrate after post roast dinner beer binge.

Thal

[argerichfan]

Cannot think of any incredible Liszt performances by women pianists at the moment...

Well now that you have presumably digested your pot roast, can you think of an incredible Liszt performance by a female pianist?  

I can give you a few hints...  

[horowitzian]

Cannot think of any incredible Liszt performances by women pianists at the moment, but my mind is struggling to concentrate after post roast dinner beer binge.

Thal

Ha!! 

[ronde_des_sylphes]

Cannot think of any incredible Liszt performances by women pianists at the moment, but my mind is struggling to concentrate after post roast dinner beer binge.

Thal

Marie Pleyel, Chopin's apartment, c. 1836 (allegedly)?   

[thalbergmad]

I almost dropped me beer when i read that

[slow_concert_pianist]

Szymanowski is known to have been a pederast, not a pedophile.

Wagner and Mel Gibson are both antisemites who experienced success and fame during their lifetimes, but I don't think they're of comparable talent and artistry.

Part of the Lisztian legend was that he made women swoon, so I'm not sure how Liszt would be for men.  And the last time I looked, "poofs" were men; I guess Chopin is for everyone, then. 

Ha ha well there is a connection with music and sex....currently the most henious form of sexual practice as defined by the "moral brigade" is pedophilia. In a 100 years, there will be the same amnesty they gave the gays today. And as for Mel Gibson.....well he transcends morality lol. However I don't think either he or Wagner is/were actually "antisemitic", rather they protest(ed) some of the mindless acts/doctrines personified "in the interest" of Judaism (mostly derived from the Talmud).

The despot Nero also made his audiences swoon in his extended vocal recitals. Mind you most were carried out only to dramatically recover outside the auditorium well out of ear's reach.

[smithreeseii]

chopin and schubert

A few people on here commenting on how they can't stand Schubert....REALLY?  It is difficult for me to imagine appreciating romantic music and not viewing Schubert as a genius of the time period.  His chamber works are absolutely amazing.

And Wagner was definitely anti-semitic.  In multiple essays, he accused Jews of being, and this may sound familiar, a harmful and alien element in German culture...and that is specifically why Adolf Hitler was so fond of him.  In fact, Wagner's music was used as propaganda against the Jews during the rein of the Third Reich, and to push the public more towards the Nazi idea of Germany.

[smithreeseii]

Bruckner - Why is he remembered? Awful.
Rachmaninoff - He is overly sentimental, even if he didn't think so himself. Most of his music is just terrificly boring. He should have stayed depressed.

And Schumann is awesome! Probably the most romantic of romantic composers, but with the compositional chops to back it up.

It is truly a shame that you have not been exposed to any music that requires the slightest attention span or any appreciation for brilliant orchestration.  Bruckner is remembered for his powerful finales, wonderful adagios and andantes, and energetic scherzos.  I ask you:  Have you ever listened to a Bruckner symphony in its entirety?  If not, you are just ignorant, if so, you are foolish and naive.

P.S.:  Rachmaninoff is a brilliant pianist and composer....listen to some work before you spray your filth on it.

[orangesodaking]

Yeah, Rachmaninoff was a brilliant composer, even though I don't listen to his works all the time. I'm not very familiar with Bruckner... could you recommend me a couple works of his to start out listening to?

[smithreeseii]

Yes, of course OrangeSodaKing.  However you really have to be ready for some intensive listening, as his symphonies are all at least an hour long each, with multiple 20-minute movements.

My favorite of his symphonies are the fourth, "Romantic," and the seventh (I would reccomend finding a recoding of Herbert von Karajan and the Berlin Philharmonic)

All of the fourth is excellent, and its difficult for me to pick a movement that really stands out.  However, for me, the adagio (second movement) of the seventh is truly the greatest part of the symphony.  It was written as sort of a funeral march for Wagner, as he died right around the time Bruckner was composing it.  Very strong melodies, primarily from the strings, which then fade out into softer themes, only to be realized again in the most epic way possible.

These are just some starter things for you, and I hope you like it.  But please, at least listen to it.

P.S.:  Sometimes I forget that this is supposed to be only a piano forum...not much from Bruckner there.  Hopefully you like symphonies as well as piano pieces.

[liordavid]

Liszt is for men.

Chopin is for women and poofs.

Thal

Most great Liszt interpretations are by men but chopin is for everyone. the thing about liszt is his music is much more tempestous than chopin which brings out that sexist stereotype

[horowitzian]

Liszt is for men.

Chopin is for women and poofs.

Thal

Go play (or listen) to Chopin's Op. 44 Polonaise and get back to us. =)

[thalbergmad]

No

I played it about 30 years ago and have no desire to return to it.

I await my sheet music for the Blahetka Polonaise, then we will have a female composer played by a man.

Thal

[horowitzian]

No

I played it about 30 years ago and have no desire to return to it.

I await my sheet music for the Blahetka Polonaise, then we will have a female composer played by a man.

Thal

That's not the point though. I don't think there is any way one could declare that piece to be anything but masculine in every sense of the word.

Can't wait to hear it!

[thalbergmad]

Can't wait to hear it!

You might hear the Blahetka but not the Chopin.

I ain't playing it.

Thal

[ahinton]

I am quite sure that there must be some kind of Thalassotherapeutic remedy for the possible ill effects of the works of any of these Romantic composers...

Best,

Alistair

[thalbergmad]

I want to seek out unplayed works and realisations and to boldly go where no pianist has gone before.

Watch this space for the worlds first Leopold de Meyer disk. Not available in the shops. Price 3 cream eggs.

Thal

[horowitzian]

You might hear the Blahetka but not the Chopin.

I ain't playing it.

Thal

I was in fact referring the the former!

[liordavid]

Liszt is for men.

Chopin is for women and poofs.

Thal

Another feminine liszt piece is the 2nd concerto

[pianist7]

sorry, I love all of them

[djealnla]

Dvořák.

[thalbergmad]

Yeh, I don't like Dvorak either.

All those wonderful melodies and not a cluster in sight.

Thal

[djealnla]

I forgot to mention Schubert.

[orangesodaking]

Tchaikovsky.

[thalbergmad]

I forgot to mention Schubert.

Have you been reading Mi Contra Fa again??

[argerichfan]

Yeh, I don't like Dvorak either.

Not the Eb Piano Quartet? That seems a shame my good mate. 

[stevebob]

Yeh, I don't like Dvorak either.

I would be surprised if the Director of the Concerto Preservation Society doesn't like even his piano concerto!

[argerichfan]

Tchaikovsky.

A rather easy target.  T's music is awesomely written, no doubt there, but so often it comes off to me as that of a neurotic queen. He spills out too much, he does not seem to know when enough is enough.

For different reasons we're used to this with Mahler, but the other great late romantic composers-  Strauss and Elgar- just seem a bit more focused and more in touch with their masculinity.

Whatever, I am guilty of secretly loving Tchaikovsky, but not rather comfortable with it.   

[argerichfan]

I would be surprised if the Director of the Concerto Preservation Society doesn't like even his piano concerto!

But that is far from his best work. Purists make a big fuss about the Kurz edition -it clashes with the 'folkish' original, oh really?, such news to us- but Kurz knew his craft.  Not all of his changes work, but some of them are really cool.

Richter always played the concerto in the original version, but it's not like we're dealing with something on the level of a Brahms D minor. 

[thinkgreenlovepiano]

I think I could probably learn to appreciate most composers. Some of them take more time than others... For some composers, I listen to a few of their pieces, don't really like them... and avoid the rest of their pieces forever. So I don't think its fair for me to say I can't stand them. I mean when I was little I thought I hated Chopin's music! But now I love it!

As much as I love the romantic era... I can't stand listening to any romantic piece for a long period of time. (When I say a long time, I mean like 12 hours a day, for a week!) I like my romantic music, in moderation   For me, baroque music is better for indulging in. (Once again, I'm comparing music to food  )

But since I feel like this thread requires me to name a composer, I'm going to say Giuseppe Concone... he counts as romantic right? My teachers have tried year after year to get me to play one of his studies, and I didn't really like any of them. :-/ Sorry Concone.

[ted]

I don't think there are any romantic composers I could truthfully say I "cannot stand". I am more inclined to like or dislike certain works rather than global categories.

What does intrigue me about this discussion is what precisely everyone means by the "feminine" and the "masculine" aspects of music. I have a job hearing these qualities, or what I understand these qualities to mean, in any music.

[thalbergmad]

I would be surprised if the Director of the Concerto Preservation Society doesn't like even his piano concerto!

I was attempting to be sarcastic, but it appears I have failed.

Thal

[point of grace]

Another feminine liszt piece is the 2nd concerto

i really started to dislike liszt when i heard he wrote un sospiro (so romantic, i wanted to play the piece in my wedding day) for his uncle!!! come on!! so wired....

[healdie]

Interesting that at the beginning of the thread Schumann took so much of a beating, as Schumann is one of the few Romantics I can like and have a desire to play along with Brahms and Schubert (just looked down my pile of sheet music for any other romantics that have gotten under the radar but they're are none)

but I particularly dislike Chopin for all of the reasons stated before and more, I also don't really like Rachmaninoff although I won't go as far to say I can't stand him but I just don't like him too sentimental for my tastes

I'd also go with much of what has been said about Tchaikovsky as well before, although I do like his operas and some of his symphonies have their moments

(I will also point that my dislike for Romantics mainly is limited to Piano works I really love many of the orchestral/Operatic/Chamber works etc)

[yodaofpiano]

I can't say that I love Schumann's piano music (not that I hate it, but it doesn't somewhat bore me) but I love a lot of his other instrumental music. His cello and violin concertos are amazing, and if you're someone who's new to schumann or just doesn't want to listen to anything that he wrote for piano, try these two pieces.

[werq34ac]

I used to not be able to stand Schumann and thought it was a load of rubbish, but one day, something clicked and I think that Schumann's music is absolutely beautiful. The piano concerto is one of the best piano concertos written. Although not very influential, Schumann really captured the soul of Romanticism.

If I had to pick one composer I couldn't stand, I'd have to pick Grieg. When attempting to be beautiful, he ends up with cheesy. When going for sad, he gets dull. When he goes for happy, I want to shoot myself. Though I do like his Wedding at Troldhaugen and his G minor string quartet. The piano concerto.. only if its played absolutely fantastically.

Following closely is Mendelssohn. Though he wrote beautiful music, it's not as profoundly humane as Schumann and to be honest, he's really overrated. I don't ever want to hear his violin concerto again. Ever.

Brahms I used to not like, but now I like it.
I don't like most Schubert especially some of the impromptus (my god, I can't stand no. 2 and 4 from Op. 90) and one of his musical moments (I think it was no. 2). He tends to be a bit repetitive. Apparently the way it's supposed to be interpreted is walking along and looking at a tree at different perspectives.
Though I do like the Wanderer Fantasy a lot.

I really can't see why anyone would hate Chopin...

[nataliethepianist]

Schumann isn't my favorite... though I do find pieces once in a while I like of his. Unfortunately, I have not ventured off and listened to other romantic composers besides Liszt and Chopin, and though I could name many, I could not answer this fairly. I don't really know why I shared this. Okay. Bye.

[refugepiano]

I don't really like the works of Schubert, Mussorgsky, Tchaikovsky and (possibly controversially) Liszt, with the exception of his Totentanz.

I must admit I need to listen more of Liszt though.

[richterfan1]

I loathe and detest just about everything that came from Schumann's pen. It bores me senseless and makes me feel suicidal.

It is an insult to romanticism to describe him as a romantic composer.

Thal

bullshit!

[richterfan1]

Liszt is for men.

Chopin is for women and poofs.

Thal

another bullshit

[Derek]

Most late romantic orchestral music I have a tough time with. I think this is because I grew up listening to boogie woogie, rock, beethoven, and vivaldi, and not much else. I have little taste for things that develop really slowly or are highly complex in form (in other words, form that requires me to remember what happened 10 minutes ago...forget about it). I require "catchiness" to enjoy music. As most late romantic and later music is not catchy, I find I cannot relate to it.

[precipitato]

sigismond thalberg